Who needs X or a GUI... [Archive]

Stween

10-01-2002, 09:52 AM

I use both. Yes, you can get by using one or the other most of the time, but in terms of performance you need to use both.

I know people always shout that you can do anything you want from the CL, but when this requires reading man pages to apply bizarre combinations of switches and obeying strange syntaxes to do something a GUI application could have done quicker, I begin to lose sight of why the CL should be used for some stuff if your system is more than capable of running an X server.

I'll edit small configuration files, burn CD's and play CD's and suchlike from the CL. Browsing and so on has to be in a GUI environment for me.

Combining the two systems is the quickest way to operate :)

JP83

10-01-2002, 11:22 AM

You need X if you want to use graphical browser but you dont need if you want to watch videos. Thats pretty cool.

carrja99

10-01-2002, 12:04 PM

I tend to use both heavily to, however....
Does anyone know of any dev toolkits for creating GUIs for console programs? There's a handfule of console programs I use that require a tedious amount of typing, using switches, etc. that would be made 80% more efficient and less time consuming if I could build a simple GUI frontend for it. I recently moved over to linux about 3 months ago. At first I was switching back and forth between my linux box and my Windows system, but I've gotten so effecient at Linux that I made a permanent switch and installed Linux on my new computer. In winows, I sometimes had DOS programs like CYGWIN that I made simple VB apps to drive them from within windows.

JohnT

10-01-2002, 12:26 PM

Originally posted by carrja99
All X does is waste all your resources. Console is all ou could ever need for anything!

I just can't seem to get the Gimp to load IN the console. :mad:

JohnT

10-01-2002, 12:28 PM

Originally posted by carrja99
I tend to use both heavily to, however....
Does anyone know of any dev toolkits for creating GUIs for console programs? There's a handfule of console programs I use that require a tedious amount of typing, using switches, etc. that would be made 80% more efficient and less time consuming if I could build a simple GUI frontend for it. I recently moved over to linux about 3 months ago. At first I was switching back and forth between my linux box and my Windows system, but I've gotten so effecient at Linux that I made a permanent switch and installed Linux on my new computer. In winows, I sometimes had DOS programs like CYGWIN that I made simple VB apps to drive them from within windows.

Investigation of Slack might be worth your while; as it pertains to gui in the console. There are several applications where they use this.

JohnT

10-01-2002, 12:31 PM

Originally posted by mrBen

The answer is that both have their uses, and you need both to be truly efficient. This is where Windows and Macs traditionally fell down - they concentrated so much on the GUI that they forgot the power of the CLI. But it is equally important to remember the power of the GUI. IMHO.

Excellent answer.:D

mr orion77

10-01-2002, 06:01 PM

hmm im confused. so how could i view my folders with the console as in images. yet i can start gimp but not view actual folders.

i think im just muddling myself! i do it a lot:p

JohnT

10-01-2002, 08:36 PM

Originally posted by mr orion77
hmm im confused. so how could i view my folders with the console as in images. yet i can start gimp but not view actual folders.

i think im just muddling myself! i do it a lot:p

You cannot view images (picture formats) in the console of any kind.

kam

10-01-2002, 08:47 PM

Originally posted by JohnT

You cannot view images (picture formats) in the console of any kind.
Wrong. zgv. Unless that's not truly in the console.

JohnT

10-01-2002, 09:05 PM

Originally posted by kam

Wrong. zgv. Unless that's not truly in the console.

It doesn't fit my definition of "Picture Format", that's why I included it, as SVGAlib I thought was to gray of an area for the particular discussion at hand.

CrashTestDummy9

10-01-2002, 09:25 PM

If some of you guys would quit ressurecting dinosaurs and build or buy a real computer then having a GUI wouldnt be such a "burden on your resources" . No one in their right mind would want to do EVERYTHING by entering a ****load of text all the time . Come on , your mouse and that Radeon 9700 Pro have to be used for something dont they ?

JohnT

10-01-2002, 09:40 PM

Yea, and even "resurrecting" too. :D

CrashTestDummy9

10-01-2002, 10:04 PM

Yeah that too !

carrja99

10-02-2002, 10:24 AM

I think the usage of Console and X depends on the purpose of your computer. If your running linux strictly as a server of some type, there may be very little reason for you to need X for anything. Or, as in the example of my computer illiterate friend I installed linux for, he uses his PC just to browse the web, word processing and such, and hasn't even touched console since I installed linux for him a month ago. While the majority of us "regular" users probably need to use a bit of both, especially since building apps and using such programs as g++ REQUIRE console, which is usually accessed simply from within X.

Current Screenshot:
http://www.geocities.com/jay_c_the_man/screenshot.jpeg

sarah31

10-02-2002, 01:37 PM

Originally posted by devurandomguy
xmms. Somebody tell me of a CL program that can play mp3/ogg files (or run as a frontend for mpg123/ogg123) and xmms is gone.

mp3blaster

Fryguy8

10-02-2002, 01:47 PM

I'm always in X, however I make extensive use of aterms.. the command line is something you can't live w/o (it's just so much easier and safer to manually edit config files if you know what you are doing), and a GUI is critical for the web. The web nowadays is designed to be graphical (look at how much "non-text" there is on your current web browser screen). Other than web browsing, I see no real need for a gui, sure I use xmms and x-chat, because they are a bit easier to handle, but it's not really necessary.

JohnT

10-02-2002, 02:12 PM

Originally posted by Fryguy8
it's just so much easier and safer to manually edit config files if you know what you are doing.

So if you don't know what your doing, what would you suggest as the safest and easiest thing to edit with?

:p

carrja99

10-02-2002, 03:23 PM

Originally posted by JohnT

So if you don't know what your doing, what would you suggest as the safest and easiest thing to edit with?

:p

Dunno. Microsoft Word? Heheheh. I do recal my frustration the first time I used vi, assuming that it was simular to DOS edit, I began typing right away and was met with a bunch of loud beeps! Personally, I like using vi for alot of configuration file editing and for C++ programs, but sometimes I switch to an X-based text editor to cut & paste when a program has repetive statements. I've noticed alot of people in my CSC class where we're required to compile and run our progrmas in linux tend to use joe rather than vi... don't know why.

JohnT

10-02-2002, 04:55 PM

When I just need to edit in a terminal I tend to use Pico.

kam

10-02-2002, 08:41 PM

Originally posted by JohnT
When I just need to edit in a terminal I tend to use Pico.
Me too. :D Its easy to use and easy to learn. I hate that mode thing in vi.

carrja99

10-02-2002, 09:44 PM

Yes, vi is a little difficult at first, but luckily I had a refrence of the commands in the back of a LINUX COMPLETE book I got, and after you learn it becomes quite easy, and the modes, while a bit harsh at first, make it a very powerful text editor.

line_number

10-03-2002, 01:01 AM

Originally posted by carrja99
All X does is waste all your resources. Console is all ou could ever need for anything!

except spell check

CrashTestDummy9

10-03-2002, 01:31 AM

Originally posted by carrja99
All X does is waste all your resources. Console is all ou could ever need for anything! What resources am I wasting ? My 512mb of DDR or my 1.4ghz of processor ? Oh wait...Maybe its my limited disk space , I only have 55gbs . <~~~~~~~~~~See my previous post . Get off your wallets guys .

carrja99

10-03-2002, 12:59 PM

Resources are important for those of us who want to resurrect our dinosaurs and use them as webservers!

CrashTestDummy9

10-03-2002, 03:46 PM

Originally posted by carrja99
Resources are important for those of us who want to resurrect our dinosaurs and use them as webservers! Ok . Why dont you dig up an old General Electric 225 while your at it and see what you can do with it . Me personally , i'm waiting for AMDs Hammer line of processors to show up on newegg.com for less than 300 bucks .

mr orion77

10-04-2002, 06:22 PM

:p of course i know u cant view images in the console. i was testing ur knowledge of linux;) .
if linux ever gets some other packages worthy of a designer ie web and lightwave is ported then. i'd use the x more but for now its 50/50 4 me too.

JohnT

10-04-2002, 07:08 PM

Originally posted by mr orion77
:p of course i know u cant view images in the console. i was testing ur knowledge of linux;) .

Silly me. :cool:

carrja99

10-05-2002, 12:53 PM

I thought you could. I thought you could also watch dvds, any movie format, browse the web with all the bells and whistles, and create complex 3d models all from within the console!!

JohnT

10-05-2002, 02:21 PM

Originally posted by carrja99
I thought you could. I thought you could also watch dvds, any movie format, browse the web with all the bells and whistles, and create complex 3d models all from within the console!!

Yes, the console is all you'll ever need.

Don't forget Omni-Max with Dolby surround sound. A large pocorn and medium coke. Oh and one other thing , maybe a slightly larger monitor.

carrja99

10-05-2002, 02:47 PM

That's right... I use console to create my own home movie theater!! I have a great big gigantic plasma TV in my dorm with my computer hooked up to it... and all I need is console to emulate that theater feeling with it. HEhehehh.... not really, just still amused by the "console is all you could ever need! Only newbies use X!" arguement I had with some guy in #linux on DALnet... and the basis for this whole thread. I still don't understand what that guy was thinking... "Only newbies use X!" Okaaaay...

JohnT

10-05-2002, 03:01 PM

I've cleared ten acres, set-up rows of speakers, installed a central building for a snack bar and topped it off with a giant 500X300 ft screen, so I can su to root in relative bliss along with hundreds of other consolites.:confused:

(Oh and I charge a small fee to pay for all the wasted resources, which BTW are governed under the 1984 edict of the EPA for endangered consoles)

CrashTestDummy9

10-05-2002, 04:37 PM

Originally posted by carrja99
Resources are important for those of us who want to resurrect our dinosaurs and use them as webservers! Ok you nut . You had me going . I thought you were serious about the console advocacy . There are definately people who ARE serious . Most them should be in a mental institute or at least on Prozac .:D

carrja99

10-05-2002, 05:43 PM

I have 2 T1 connections in my dorm (and no roomate), I'm planning on setting up a webserver (if it is possible) but I'd rather not hog my bandwidth on my newer computer, so the ideal IMHO would be to do a barebones install on my old Dell OptiPlex to just handle the webserving by itself. Therefore there would really be no reason to run X on it, console is good enough for THAT use of Linux. (As for my other machine, I've hardly used straight console, just alot of Xterm windows :D )

novafluxx

10-06-2002, 06:48 AM

That is a damned good answer!

sonictooth

10-09-2002, 02:14 PM

seejpeg: displays images on the console...
its a console program that displays jpegs

my mouse is broken so i use the console : )

JohnT

10-09-2002, 02:31 PM

Originally posted by sonictooth
seejpeg: displays images on the console...
its a console program that displays jpegs

my mouse is broken so i use the console : )

Pray that your keyboard continues:D

sonictooth

10-10-2002, 11:45 AM

i do pray : )

but i do wish my mouse would work. i like the console, but X is sure pretty : )

JohnT

10-10-2002, 01:54 PM

Originally posted by sonictooth
i do pray : )

but i do wish my mouse would work. i like the console, but X is sure pretty : )

Is your mouse physically broken or just not configured?

carrja99

10-10-2002, 07:04 PM

Your mouse is broken? Hahahaha.. that's one of the funniest things I've ever heard. To have a computer with no mouse reminds me of back when I was in elementry school and had a Tandy 1000... using the keyboard to navigate the menus in Deskmate 1.0! Seriously dude, you should go out and buy a mouse. Most standard ones are cheap, maybe $10 at most, and at my local pawn shops there are a few that only cost $1 each. Heck, send me some stamps and a box and I could send you one! I have about 4 left over ones!

hop-frog

10-10-2002, 09:43 PM

I use X. I have no reason to use the console much. My computer runs perfect enough, does what I want it to when I want it to without it breaking on me. I use the terminals when I get too lazy to click around with the mouse. :)

Gnu/Vince

10-11-2002, 11:29 AM

This place has become unrecognizable... First because of all the members I don't know (and none of the veterans have posted here), but also because mentality seems to have changed vastly.

Back when I joined (beginning of 2000), most people here _loved_ the command line for one simple reason: power. If you've used a GUI all your life, you have no idea the ammount of power one can have at his fingertips. Back in 2000 (and before that), we used Linux and *BSD because they were stable and powerful. Most command-line applications are stable and a lot are very powerful. Vim, ls, dd, w3m, *****x, etc. have never flunked on me, but I don't think anyone can argue that Vim isn't powerful. GUI applications on the other hand are harder to program and thus, easier to break.

When I say that the command line is powerful, I mean that you let the computer do the job; most of the time, the GUI inverses the roles since a GUI cannot be used in batch mode. For example, if I want to download all the pr0n movies from a website, I have one line of Ruby code to write:

ruby -e '"01".upto("50") { |x| system("wget http://www.pr0n-land.cum/videos/video#{x}.mpg") }'

This may seem like a long line to write, but it takes 15 seconds to write and it will automatically download 50 files for me! Talk about Power! On the other hand, doing it the GUI way means individually right-clicking each file, selecting "Save as...", pressing OK, moving to the next file, etc. Maybe it's more "aestetic" or "cute" or "intuative" to do it with a GUI, but to me, the role of a computer remains to make me work as less as possible. In this particular case, the command-line beats the GUI way hands down, so I will use the command-line.

If the command-line helps you do your job more easily, why not use it?! Read this:

The power of C++. The ease of scripting with Perl. More fun and easier than both! It is so very nice to watch a masterpiece at work. I come to work and launch my Ruby script then kick back and watch in awe as it does 45 minutes worth of work for me unattended!!! Mind you, the work it does used to be accomplished in no less than 4 weeks by hand. This is powerful stuff, my friends.

The important word in that testimonial is 'unattended'. This guy doesn't need to press any button, right-click on any link or any of the usual GUI stuff: he types the name of his script and it does his job. I do not think this could be achieved without a powerful command-line.

Of course, the command-line is not a silver bullet: anything multimedia sucks on the command line and you damn better use a windowing system. But when it comes to doing administration stuff, doing repetitive tasks, etc. don't you just love if you can kick back in your chair and watch the computer do your job? I sure do. You can stick batch scripts in cronjobs and never have to press anything for stuff to be done. Think of how much fun apt-get is when it updates your whole system without you having to do ANYTHING. Make sure a software doesn't make you work, make sure you have a software to make the computer work for you.

Computer power users use the command-line extensively. Are you a power user?

JohnT

10-11-2002, 05:00 PM

The power of C++. The ease of scripting with Perl. More fun and easier than both! It is so very nice to watch a masterpiece at work. I come to work and launch my Ruby script then kick back and watch in awe as it does 45 minutes worth of work for me unattended!!! Mind you, the work it does used to be accomplished in no less than 4 weeks by hand. This is powerful stuff, my friends.

I agree completely, but you'll have to admit that the gui evolved from the commandline for a reason. Humans, by default are visual by nature. Relying, by evolvment, on our 5 senses.The intake of the imprint is not encumbered by any ability/inability to assume any logical progression, therfore opening up a door to many rather than few.

Gnu/Vince

10-11-2002, 05:52 PM

Originally posted by JohnT

I agree completely, but you'll have to admit that the gui evolved from the commandline for a reason. Humans, by default are visual by nature. Relying, by evolvment, on our 5 senses.The intake of the imprint is not encumbered by any ability/inability to assume any logical progression, therfore opening up a door to many rather than few.

GUI's evolved from the command-line to make it easier for most people to approach programming. But the GUI is a bad (IMO) evolution of the command-line: it made the interactive stuff easier, more intuative, yes, but it forgot the power users! Those who wanted to manipulate their tools in batch mode were forgotten. There are _VERY_ few applications that have a GUI that can be used in batch mode (can't think of any on top of my head). If it were easy to just bind command-line options to widgets (or vice versa) so that using an application in interactive mode (GUI) is still the same, but that if you need to perform things in batch-mode, that it still be possible somehow.

carrja99

10-11-2002, 06:00 PM

I agree. Although I use console regularly and admit that it's power is the very core of linux (lust compare console to MSDOS and you can easily see my point!), X provides added simplicity. For example, if I have an install file that has instructions for editing a certain file, say .bashrc, it's simple to run one term window with vim viewing the INSTALL file, and another term window open below it with the file I'm editing. This is alos good with gcc, as I can edit and :w the program in one window, and run it in the other so I don't have to keep running and exiting vim. Likewise, I won't lie, I just love having a beautiful desktop that makes people drop thier jaw when they see it!

-wassup-

10-12-2002, 10:45 AM

how can i get my linux to boot in runlevel 5 without starting x?? i try it in runlevel 4 but i think my network is disabled because i cannot ftp to my server. heres another thing...can i run gui applications like xman through the console?? wouldnt i need x for that and not a desktop interface running? thanks for ur help:D

jbm

10-14-2002, 12:54 PM

Originally posted by devurandomguy

Two graphical apps I use: Galeon-cvs, and xmms. Somebody tell me of a CL program that can play mp3/ogg files (or run as a frontend for mpg123/ogg123) and xmms is gone.

http://www.tf.hut.fi/~flu/cplay/

kemical

10-15-2002, 05:40 AM

screen and ratpoison :)

sickb0y82

10-15-2002, 11:12 AM

Hey, I installed RedHat 8.0 just the other day. I've been an MCSE and a Microsoft loyalist for the past number of years. Then, this past sunday, I recieved 3 odd CDs containing RedHat 8.0. Since then, all microsoft operating systems on all of my machines have been formatted and replaced with this god-like os. Point: For the past 2 days, I've been using strichtly GUI. I am slowly but surely learning. I would love to use the CLI, but honestly I have no idea how to even install an application or even change my gui using GNOME. I think the reason why many people use just the GUI is because they are in my position: asking people "What the hell is a CLI??" Most of us asking this question really don't even WANT to know what a CLI is because merely just looking at a terminal console is intimidating enough, let alone compiling kernels and configuring applications without our safety blanket that is the GUI. By the way, does anyone know any good resources, be it on the internet or books in a store, to get a better understanding of linux; how to use, and maintain it? The past two days has been hell for me with Linux, but I am way too excited to let this one go without a fight. Thanks all.

K9DI

10-15-2002, 11:50 AM

Hello,
Wayne K9DI es Leader Dog Sequoa here. as a blind person (95%) I can think of at least one group of Linux users who prefer the CLI over a GUI. Visually impaired or totally blind users. the cmmand line coupled with a screen reading program is the almost perfect environment for blind people to compute, compared to the torture and anguish of trying to navigate a GUI with a screen reading program.
just some food for thought, "Knowledge is POWER!!"
73
de
Wayne K9DI

CrashTestDummy9

10-15-2002, 11:59 AM

Originally posted by K9DI
Hello,
Wayne K9DI es Leader Dog Sequoa here. as a blind person (95%) I can think of at least one group of Linux users who prefer the CLI over a GUI. Visually impaired or totally blind users. the cmmand line coupled with a screen reading program is the almost perfect environment for blind people to compute, compared to the torture and anguish of trying to navigate a GUI with a screen reading program.
just some food for thought, "Knowledge is POWER!!"
73
de
Wayne K9DI Thats why choice is so wonderful . Being a person with perfect sight(relatively) , I currently prefer a GUI but mostly because of the reasons I use a computer at all . I watch DVDs , browse the visually tantilizing web , and play video games . Without a GUI these appealing (to me anyways) aspects of computing would be taken away and I would revert to being a couch potato with a remote control in one hand and a cold beer in the other . But I can see(no pun or offense intended) where you are coming from .

carrja99

10-15-2002, 10:00 PM

Yes, that is of course a pretty good spot where console obviously outshines a GUI. Also, I've heard there is also a pretty good interface for bash that allows users to issue commands vocally. Although I know zilch about it (I admit it would be cool as heck to issue commands as if I was speaking to the computer on the enterprise, although not as well, I have no time to hassle with it) it would be great for those who may be physically impaired in one way or another where it is needed.

Wolfger

10-15-2002, 10:22 PM

I (almost) always use X, *and* I (almost) always have an eterm window open too. Why limit yourself to just one way of doing things? If I wanted that, I'd use Microsoft!

DarkJedi9

10-16-2002, 11:40 AM

Originally posted by Wolfger
I (almost) always use X, *and* I (almost) always have an eterm window open too. Why limit yourself to just one way of doing things? If I wanted that, I'd use Microsoft!

Same here. For some reason I still have a default runlevel of three (no X) but usually I'll go right into X. I use Eterm for almost all of my stuff but it's nice to have the graphics up to make it look nice, and so I can be asking questions here or looking up info for the stuff I'm doing in Eterm. Also, it's easier to manage several Eterms at the same time then use the alt-F1, alt-F2, etc. in the console.

Wolfger

10-16-2002, 02:56 PM

Originally posted by DarkJedi9
Also, it's easier to manage several Eterms at the same time then use the alt-F1, alt-F2, etc. in the console.

Not necessarily easier, but it sure is nice if you want to do some comparisson shopping (contents of one directory/file/whatever versus contents of another) to be able to put both console windows side by side.

My only problem with alt-F1 et al, was trying to remember which console was doing what. Especially when coming back to my computer after spending a weekend out-of-town :)

DarkJedi9

10-16-2002, 03:14 PM

That's a good point. I've found that the best use for mutliple Eterms is viewing a readme on one while moving files from the directory displayed in another two a place displayed in the third as a fourth one reads a file in one of those places to make sure that it's the one I need but don't forget...well you get the idea. I love being able to have two (or many more) completely functional working environments at the same time.

Gnu/Vince

10-16-2002, 03:48 PM

Command-line commandos do not use multiple ttys: they use screen!

carrja99

10-16-2002, 04:46 PM

Command-line commandos... I like that. The first thing I pictured was some guy dressed in army gear typing like crazy in a linux console.

WES187

10-18-2002, 11:30 AM

it is more complex then that.. it is more your preference and how you work better.. for a server I would definantley only use console, but for a workstation I would definantly use a gui.. console is still good when you use a good framebuffer, but you can still have up to 64 different desktops in X which all can have about 6 different Eterms/xterms which allow true multitasking (: do the math, so I think both are good, it just depends on what you do and what you use it for. (:

SunOfTux

10-19-2002, 04:44 AM

i find that using a combination of Xwindows and the command line terminal is easiest for me.
for example, if i want to download a group of files relating to a particular subject, like security, for example, while still viewing the webpage i conveniently open up a terminal window and create a new directory for the files with mkdir.
overall, i use xwindows when it seems most practical (surfing the internet, or composing a document in OpenOffice), but i find the command line far easier for things like making directories and copying files, because, frankly, right click, left click can be a pain in the butt

carrja99

10-22-2002, 01:13 PM

Bah! Console is all you need to surf the internet!! Without X bogging dow your resources, it's BLAZING FAsT!

DarkJedi9

10-22-2002, 03:09 PM

Originally posted by carrja99
Bah! Console is all you need to surf the internet!! Without X bogging dow your resources, it's BLAZING FAsT!

With what, Links?

carrja99

10-22-2002, 04:34 PM

No... LYNX!! It's blazing fast!

JohnT

11-05-2002, 09:35 PM

Now here is where the CLI and the GUI come together.

http://modeemi.cs.tut.fi/~tuomov/ion/

carrja99

11-05-2002, 11:36 PM

EXCELLENT!!:D

kozart

11-09-2002, 05:20 PM

I myself use console... Mostly because I just use putty to log into my box alot and I got used to it. I have my windows machine for a GUI...

COMMAND LINE RULES!!!

theevilblah

11-10-2002, 06:17 PM

I browse the web a lot and links just doesnt cut it for me.

CrashTestDummy9

11-10-2002, 07:14 PM

Originally posted by kozart
I myself use console... Mostly because I just use putty to log into my box alot and I got used to it. I have my windows machine for a GUI...

COMMAND LINE RULES!!! Dont you like Linux's GUI as much as Windows?

Vlad902

11-10-2002, 07:18 PM

Originally posted by CrashTestDummy9
Dont you like Linux's GUI as much as Windows?
I like it ALOT more... I am not locked out of the settings... I control everything about it! Mostly what I need X for is more that 6 terminal/tty's and graphics...

CrashTestDummy9

11-10-2002, 07:33 PM

Originally posted by Vlad902
I like it ALOT more... I am not locked out of the settings... I control everything about it! Mostly what I need X for is more that 6 terminal/tty's and graphics... I hear ya . Im not at the "like it more" stage yet but im getting there .

In another yr or two there will be NO reason for any half way computer savy person to NOT use Linux for everything . I know im not building any more Windows machines for myself . I will continue to build Win machines for customers just because I like building computers and the market isnt ready(at least MY market) for Linux machines . Most of the people here in SC are lucky to know how to connect to the internet , let alone use Linux .

Someday......

Vlad902

11-10-2002, 07:45 PM

Your right, mostly people are not ready to leave their "precious Windows". But I am, Before 2003, that virus is gone from HDD's

carrja99

11-10-2002, 08:07 PM

Originally posted by theevilblah
I browse the web a lot and links just doesnt cut it for me.
It's Lynx. LUNX!! Not Links... Lynx!! BAH!!! Everyone always misspells it!!:mad:

Vlad902

11-10-2002, 08:12 PM

Originally posted by carrja99
It's Lynx. LUNX!! Not Links... Lynx!! BAH!!! Everyone always misspells it!!:mad:

NO! There is Lynx AND Links... Links is an upgraded Lynx... jeez dude do some research...

frankprogramer

11-10-2002, 08:18 PM

If I am compiling something, or doing some type of system maintenence then I will use the CLI. Otherwise I will use X. I have to have it for web design. I need graphics editing programs.
-Frankie
Plus, it's just cooler to have an awesome looking desktop.

CrashTestDummy9

11-10-2002, 08:23 PM

Originally posted by frankprogramer
If I am compiling something, or doing some type of system maintenence then I will use the CLI. Otherwise I will use X. I have to have it for web design. I need graphics editing programs.
-Frankie
Plus, it's just cooler to have an awesome looking desktop. Yeah , I guess its kinda hard to do graphics design when your computer isnt using some kind of GUI so you can "see" the end result .

You have to excuse the CLIers because they are just freaks who still drive Model A Fords to work .:D

Just joking guys so dont burn a cross in my front yard ok?

Vlad902

11-10-2002, 09:25 PM

Just joking guys so dont burn a cross in my front yard ok?

We wont... We'll do something much worse...:eek:

carrja99

11-11-2002, 12:31 AM

We wont... We'll do something much worse...

Like...? Burn a copy of X-Windows in his front yard? I say "BAH!" to graphics editing in X... you can do it just as well in CLI... all you need to do is be able to picture the end result in your mind as you MANUALLY create the image!:D

Vlad902

11-11-2002, 01:10 AM

yeah man! Here try this

01010101010000101010110100101101010101010101001010 10101100101010100101010101010101010101

*snickers* Dissed! :p

theevilblah

11-11-2002, 01:14 AM

Originally posted by Vlad902
NO! There is Lynx AND Links... Links is an upgraded Lynx... jeez dude do some research...
Links is also a browser

GirIsMyHero

11-11-2002, 05:01 PM

in all things moderation....

what good does it do you to restrict yourself to one way of doing things, for mere principle....

frankprogramer

11-12-2002, 08:33 PM

I notice that you have a link to your screen shot in your signature... I guess your not completely CLI!
-Frankie

gumgrok

11-13-2002, 12:59 AM

Well I use console for everything. Of course, this is not because I find it more useful than X window, but it is because I cannot seem to get my NVIDIA kernel to compile on my system, and therefore I cannot use X. At first it was hard, but the more I learn about the console, the more I realize I can do with it.

carrja99

11-13-2002, 01:19 AM

hmmm... what distro are you using?

gumgrok

11-13-2002, 05:31 AM

I am running Debian 3.0 r0, with a 2.4.18 kernel that I compiled.

frankprogramer

11-13-2002, 10:23 PM

The purpose of using Linux, or any other OS, is for the purpose of using it. It is not practical to type 'mv file-1 /home/x/x/x/x/' when you could click and drag instantly. The real issue is "Practicality vs Functionality". If there is no compromise, go with the most practical.
-Frankie

carrja99

11-13-2002, 11:18 PM

Originally posted by gumgrok
I am running Debian 3.0 r0, with a 2.4.18 kernel that I compiled.

Hmmm.. is it your first diestro? I recall you saying that X doesn't like your video card. Are you absolutely sure this is the case? Becase my first distro was Debian, and I couldn't get X to run and at the time I thought it was my video card. Then I got Mandrake and it ran fine.

In reality, it all turned out that I really didn't know what I was doing.. now I can get X running on Debian with ease... but back then I was clueless!! I spent a fair amount of time downloading and installing drivers for my videocard that I didn't need, when it all turned out I just needed to run Xconfigurator!

mike_the_pengui

11-14-2002, 10:39 AM

I use both with the gui as default: this is why...

I dual-boot. :(

(Yes master, whip me again the way you like it.)

Yess, yess, ooooohhh!

My wife still whimpers through the windows reboots, reboots, reboots, ad infinitum reboots but she likes it that way.

My daughter though is advancing in life. It seems that she is starting to use linux for almost everything (but has no idea or desire to learn the console when the gui does the job for her). She only uses windows for (mostly) all our games (which are windows 3.1 or better but for some reason don't work well on linux --go figure.win

My son is only 3 but already loves the linux boot -up (he laughs at all the messages rolling by) and LOOOOOVES XMMS with the kjofol skins (big aerosmith fan at 3!! YESSSS. DOWN WITH BARNEY (ad infinitum)).

the gui is prominent for the continuation and proliferation of converts from winBLOZE in my family.

BUT you should definitely get experience with the console. Like when I moved from dos to win3.1 (whip me harder master) I found some things were done much faster and more efficiently with the command line.

ps:...does linux stand for "like it now, use X" ??

carrja99

11-14-2002, 12:09 PM

I definately agree. I set up Linux for a friend of mine who's slightly comput iliterate, showed him how to access the internet (all he really needs) and set up WINE so he could run kazaa and set up a good GUI based front end for cdrecord. After 3 months, I'm betting he still hasn't even touched the terminal.

GUI is always the most important part of an OS... even though console is great for us computer addicts. LIke I stated earlier, I usually run X with about 10 gnome-terminals open. :D

Hayl

11-14-2002, 12:27 PM

Originally posted by gumgrok
I am running Debian 3.0 r0, with a 2.4.18 kernel that I compiled.

why won't it compile?

i have compiled it under debian many many times and it always works fine for me.

carrja99

11-14-2002, 12:29 PM

My guess still is that it is his first distro. Debian was my first distro and it was a NIGHTMARE! Debian is definately not a distro for those just getting started with linux.

Hayl

11-14-2002, 12:38 PM

possibly... but only if you don't use the pgi installer. once it's installed (properly) it's easier to maintain for most people (imho).

but still. i'm going to help him fix his nvidia problem because that is no harder under debian than any other distro.

gumgrok

11-14-2002, 11:36 PM

Yeah this is my first linux distro. I jigdo'd the first two iso's for debian, and installed them. I thought it would be easy, but little did I know that I would have to in the near future do things like compile a kernel and type all sorts of wild commands into a beautiful console prompt. But anyways, the problems I have had are as such:
X does not natively support GeForce 4s
I downloaded source for Nvidia kernel and glx
Ran make with the GLX, worked happily.
Ran make with NV kernel, didn't work.
Compiled my 2.2.20 kernel with latest GCC
Ran make with NV kernel, got farther, but had unresolved symbols
Compiled new 2.4.18 kernel with latest GCC
Ran make with NV kernel, compiled but depmod gives me this error:
depmod:*** Unresolved symbols in /?/?/2.4.18/modules/video
(note that the directory I just put may not be right, I forgot what it really was.)

Not sure what to do now.

gumgrok

11-16-2002, 09:17 AM

Ahh nevermind all that, JP83 suggested that I reinstall my modutils and binutils with tar packages and it fixed my problems! Thanks!

linux12414

11-16-2002, 08:15 PM

Originally posted by carrja99
Heheheh... Just wanted to see what kind of responses this may get. I've heard several people say they just use console, it's all they need. While others couldn't live without a GUI of some type. So here it is... the big question to what may be a long thread.... WHat do you use? Console Only or X-Windows? Why?
=========
I use each about 50-50. Some things are *much* easier done from the command line--most things, actually. But I gotta admit, I like the eye candy--merely a backdrop for the console.

jthomet

11-16-2002, 08:34 PM

What was this, just flamebait?!?? Okay, put a question like this right alongside, "Why do you still use Windows?"

Look, if we're ever going to give people a reason to completely ABANDON Windows, we MUST do so with a GUI. Why? If you were a stupid clone, would you honestly sacrifice your GUI that a user-friendly feel that presents you with all of your options at the outset (or, in current versions, hides them) in favor of nothing but command-line. Most of the less-adept users certainly wouldn't. If this is a linuxNEWBIE site, this question is quite irrelevant, especially when the initiator of this thread is obviously one trying to convince everybody that console is the only way to go.

hop-frog

11-17-2002, 05:00 PM

There was a time when I tried to run console-only. The problem was that I could not find enough curses programs to meet all of my needs. The programs were not smartly built. Memorizing loads of key combinations is possible, and maybe it's cool :rolleyes:, but had the programers designed their programs to follow a standard that everyone agreed upon, memorizing 9 million key combinations wouldn't be nessisary.

jrugby

11-22-2002, 10:18 AM

I only use the gui so far, Im a newbie and I believe a learning curve needs to use the "K.I.S.S" line of thinking. If I had to use the console, I could, I learned windows through DOS, I hated going to window at first, now I am running both Windows 2k and Linux.

bskahan

11-22-2002, 10:26 AM

Originally posted by hop-frog
, but had the programers designed their programs to follow a standard that everyone agreed upon, memorizing 9 million key combinations wouldn't be nessisary.

actually theres a pretty good suite of curses (and s-lang) programs that use vi style keybindings as well as allowing you to define your own.

editor: vim
mail: mutt
news: slrn
address: abook
mp3: mp3blaster
web: w3m

what else do you need?

carrja99

11-22-2002, 10:41 AM

Originally posted by jrugby
I only use the gui so far, Im a newbie and I believe a learning curve needs to use the "K.I.S.S" line of thinking. If I had to use the console, I could, I learned windows through DOS, I hated going to window at first, now I am running both Windows 2k and Linux.

Don't blame you. I absolutely needed X when I first started too! I still use X, of course, but also with about 20 gnome-terms running!

AngryPuppy

11-23-2002, 12:28 AM

I use X, but with an increasingly heavier dose of console. Even to launch programs that are in my KDE menu... I can type faster than I can find them among the forest of installed apps.

<I keep re-editing this, but the changes don't stick... adding this line to cause a more significant difference in hopes of a successful update>

linux12414

11-23-2002, 12:32 AM

Originally posted by AngryPuppy
I use X, but with an increasingly heavier dose of console. Even to launch programs that are in my KDE menu... I can type faster than I can find them among the forest of installed apps.

Very true. I especially find starting Open Office from the command line is much faster than going thru the menu.

wiseguysonly

11-30-2002, 06:23 AM

I develop web sites on linux. How is it proposed I test them through the console. And don't say Lynx.

carlywarly

11-30-2002, 06:45 AM

Originally posted by linux12414
Very true. I especially find starting Open Office from the command line is much faster than going thru the menu.

Which is why shortcuts were invented;)

JohnPurdue

12-09-2002, 11:19 AM

:) :)
I admit it I am a GUI lover - many years ago I started with a Mac (I can hear the gasps now) - I then moved onto a PC with Windows 98 - Now I use a Windows XP machine at work and play with a RedHat 8 laptop at home.
I'm sure that things work faster and smoother without having to deal with all the "eye candy"; I'm just a junkie for those crazy images.

(that and I have a very small amount of knowlege with regard to command line commands - I'm open to learning more though)

spiderbaby1958

12-09-2002, 02:50 PM

As a newbie, and not a particularly technical person by nature, I appreciate anything that makes my transition from Windows smooth and painless. It's only been a few months since I was a 100 per cent Windows dummy who had never installed an operating system. In the "real" world, I don't know anyone who uses Linux, so I've been wading through a river of technical problems without much help other than what I can find online. It's taken me this long to get a linux box together that can do word processing with a working modem. So yeah, I don't think I would have made it this far without the GUI to play with. I also owe a great deal to a lot of cool but supposedly superfluous stuff like "Potato Guy", Solitaire, and all those awesome Gnome screensavers that were an early clue that I was onto something.

Now that I got my box working, I'm starting to understand why the ability to use console is absolutely necessary to getting the full benefit of all of this painful work. So now I'm starting to take advantage of all the great Linux tutorials that are available online, and I'm beginning to learn Shell commands-- but I wouldn't have gotten here without the GUI. I'm sure this is true for many many newbies, even some who have since become seasoned gurus.

sharth

12-09-2002, 07:08 PM

personally...

console = icky

xterm = yay!

fancypiper

12-09-2002, 07:24 PM

Originally posted by mr orion77
:p of course i know u cant view images in the console.Install zgv (http://www.svgalib.org/rus/zgv/) and smile when you say that pardner ;)

Do you want some sauce for that crow you are about to eat?

rid3r

12-14-2002, 03:33 PM

you want a litle fun, use GUI, otherwise use perforated tape. :)

BlueScreen

12-17-2002, 06:47 PM

I have a computer that runs a server and a computer to be used as a workstation the server has no need to run memory intensive X-servers. The other one i use just as a workstation Games, Browsing and everything else

Floog

12-20-2002, 09:39 AM

Originally posted by wiseguysonly
I develop web sites on linux. How is it proposed I test them through the console. And don't say Lynx.

abolutely right.
and besides, how the hell are you going to enjoy porn, dvd's, and friend's video-clips of skateboarding or mountain-biking adventures if there's no graphical user interface available?

obviously there's a world of people out there who like and relate to color and images.

this thread is useless.

mssever

12-24-2002, 12:37 AM

I started with telnet to a school server. Then I switched to SSH. I only recently bought a computer capable of running Linux (I tried on my old one. No go). I almost never use console. I use X (with GNOME) and lots of gnome-terminals. I use a GUI to play MP3s (I don't know of a console program that supports playlists as well as XMMS), burn CDs, browse the web, edit graphics, etc. I use the CLI for file manipualtion (I detest nautilus), email (pine), installing/compiling sftware, editing files (vi and joe), etc.

I'm glad I was forced to use the CLI when I started, otherwise, I might not have learned it as well as I have.

Fryguy8

12-24-2002, 03:51 AM

Console people, besides resources and security, why not use X? Both of those are minor issues, and with x you can just run a bunch of terms to do things. Honestly, why run mutt/*****x/mpg123 frontend, when you can run sylpheed,xchat,xmms (maybe mutt is good, I use it in gui still but anyways).

At the very least run an X server with twm or some other equally tiny wm and just load up a ton of terms so that you can see multiple windows at the same time.

I did the console thing while building LFS and trying to get X to compile with proper driver support, and I really don't see why anyone would want to use links etc over mozilla etc.

fancypiper

12-24-2002, 04:13 AM

Originally posted by Fryguy8
I did the console thing while building LFS and trying to get X to compile with proper driver support, and I really don't see why anyone would want to use links etc over mozilla etc. How about:

1. having a broken X and needing some information from the internet to fix it.

2. Just wanting speed and information rather than waiting for a GUI launched browser with pretty pictures you don't need.

Even though I run X, I installed zgv as well, so I have graphics ability in the command line even if I break X.

When I built my Gentoo, my first emerge after my networking stuff was Links. Next was mc, then fluxbox.

I had fun and surfed the net while building, both in command line and X.

ShadyCharacter

12-24-2002, 01:33 PM

Personally I think you aLL are :confused: :rolleyes:
If you can get a program free then its always illegal... Everything costs money

ShadyCharacter

12-24-2002, 03:10 PM

Sorry about that everyone, my sister is always doing crap like that. :mad:

HippoDuck

12-25-2002, 01:54 PM

well hehe in deed.

I just installed Linux for first time, and end up without a working xwindows.

Now how am I suppoce to surf the net ?

Maybe you can suggest me some nice CLI web browser ;)

JerryW

12-26-2002, 11:54 PM

A nice CLI web browser is Lynx. I'm using it right now to write this reply.
I use Lynx on my 486 to browse the discussion boards because it's so much faster than a GUI. I still use fvwm2 as a GUI with netscape to get into web sites that use secure web pages and so forth. But the Lynx browser is just the ticket for this machine to browse character-based pages! It's awesome!

HippoDuck

12-27-2002, 04:49 AM

Hey I have lynx on my Linux also :)

Very funy :P

Well im to used to click on links with mouse tho, so I beter try to get those GF4 drivers on my desktop :)

ArtVandelay

12-29-2002, 07:22 AM

I like the mixture of the GUI environment and terminals myself for a wide variety of reasons

The cool thing about Linux Terminals is that I can spawn a swing GUI or an emacs window or whatever from it and use & "background" specifier so the terminal doesn't just halt until closing the window (can't do that from DOS prompts as far as I've seen).

Then if I'm too lazy to move the mouse all the way to the x button to close it, I can just kill the process from the terminal, and the window magically closes without me touching it!

I thought those were just the coolest things ever.
Yeah, I know. I need to get out more!

So as far as I'm concerned, long live the Terminal
and the GUI.

seabass55

12-30-2002, 04:48 PM

My big vote goes for CLI but X is getting better and better with time. As a "main"desktop I just can't stray away from Windows. No matter how we look at it, it's still a windows world.

I'm a strong believer in people learning linux in CLI first. You never know when X won't work for any reason and you've gotta do things "long hand" in CLI....it's nice to know how they are done.

My poweredge is in CLI 99% of it's time. It runs fetchmail (pine), samba and iptables. If I'm chatting on IRC I'm in *****X in CLI cause the letters are nice and big :-) If I'm downloading movies/etc off IRC I use XChat in X or for Windows just cause I don't need to push any keys...I've set everything up for mouse clicks. For grabbing stuf from FTP I really like GFTP so a "startx" is in order.

On my laptop it's X 99% of the time for web browsing, Ethereal, nmap and an occasional boot into Windows for some NetStumbler if on the road/prowl.

Really it's all in what you do. Looking at SawMill is alot nicer than looking at my iptables logs. Alot of websites are blocked at work so I fire up PUtty and use lynx from home. Do I use lynx at home? On rare occasions...just to keep up with the feel of it and some sites that don't allow you to download pictures, etc due to java scripts...well...they can't stop lynx.

If you use Linux as your main desktop computer...it would really be silly not to use X.

Sebastian

iRiDIuM

01-03-2003, 11:32 AM

The only reason I can find for a GUI is I am usually ssh'ing into an array of different machines at once and keeping many sessions open at once.

f76

01-03-2003, 09:52 PM

Hi!

2. if i didnt have a GUI i wouldnt be here reading this thread a 2:46 am. Sure i tried lynx and it works fine on simple sites but i cant figure which link goes where on sites like this.

3. Sure i wish that i could use red-carpet to install all programs. Just one click and .... whoosh.

But what about that feeling that u are talking to that cpu in the computer u bought for hard earned cash. u only get that from the cli. so im not removing her. shes my first love (1987). well not counting a few inocent kisses :)

bl8drnr

01-07-2003, 09:57 PM

Originally posted by mrBen
. This is where Windows and Macs traditionally fell down - they concentrated so much on the GUI that they forgot the power of the CLI. But it is equally important to remember the power of the GUI. IMHO.

:D excellent answer, and one of the things that I didn't like about the direction windows was taking way back when 3.1 was introduced. ie, cutting the user off from dos, granted dos wasn't all that great, but distancing the user from it (dos) was the beginnings off welding the end-users box shut....... and then came Linux :cool:

Sh0t

01-08-2003, 09:54 PM

I think half the console cowbies here are fibbing honestly.

IF you use moz or even ie, all you have to do is turn off images.

Wow no pretty images you don't need to bother you.

Artimus

01-10-2003, 08:15 PM

It all depends. If your computer is capable of X and its not a server that sits in the corner, go for X. If its 486 or down, it usually not worth it to put X on there, even if you're using Fluxbo(twm maybe, but its still pushin things)

Tiamat:
I dualboot with Windows 2000 on this box. 400mhz, 192 megs of ram. I have X installed. I have mpg321, xchat, and mozilla all running. A bunch of terminals also. I use emacs without X11 to edit files. A nice mix of X and CLI.

Fenix:
I have yet to build this box. At best it'll have a 200mhz processor, 32 megs of ram. It will be sitting in the corner without a monitor, keyboard, or mouse when I get it setup. I'll putty in from Win2k to do any work.

Prophet621

01-12-2003, 09:01 PM

I need a GUI! I use the command line as little as possible. If there is any way to avoid it ...I will. I can't ever remember the commands I need to use and I will inevidably hit something wrong durring the 800 character command and have to do it all over again, and CD to every directory I've created to keep my downloads organized is irritating. For many I know it's the greatest thing, for me, it's archaic and a general pain in the @ss.

fancypiper

01-12-2003, 09:57 PM

Originally posted by Prophet621
I can't ever remember the commands I need to use and I will inevidably hit something wrong durring the 800 character command and have to do it all over again, and CD to every directory I've created to keep my downloads organized is irritating.:D Linux has bash history. Use the up arrow and edit to correct typos.

I keep a text file called "commands" open so I can paste and edit the commands I need if they are too far up my bash history.

Try the comand mc sometimes for an easy filesystem navigation/tool interface in the command line.

tzimsce

01-13-2003, 03:33 PM

Originally posted by carrja99
I think the usage of Console and X depends on the purpose of your computer. If your running linux strictly as a server of some type, there may be very little reason for you to need X for anything. Or, as in the example of my computer illiterate friend I installed linux for, he uses his PC just to browse the web, word processing and such, and hasn't even touched console since I installed linux for him a month ago. While the majority of us "regular" users probably need to use a bit of both, especially since building apps and using such programs as g++ REQUIRE console, which is usually accessed simply from within X.

Current Screenshot:
http://www.geocities.com/jay_c_the_man/screenshot.jpeg

It seems your intention of starting this thread was to bait others into helping you with support issues. I mean, you haven't really said much this whole thread, other than the typically, brainless "just talking to be talking" junk like "it all depends on your needs". Damn, you're a waste of bandwidth, dude.

Sh0t

01-13-2003, 04:43 PM

Ouch

carrja99

01-13-2003, 09:07 PM

Originally posted by tzimsce
It seems your intention of starting this thread was to bait others into helping you with support issues. I mean, you haven't really said much this whole thread, other than the typically, brainless "just talking to be talking" junk like "it all depends on your needs". Damn, you're a waste of bandwidth, dude.

Heh... I had no idea this thread was still going! However, my purpose of starting this thread had nothing to do with support issues, in fact I started this thread in response to some guy on irc saying that people who use X are retarded sensless idiots who shouldn't even being running linux in the first place if they run that waste of resources X.

I was curious as to how many people really think that a GUI is bullcrap and sit at home everynight using nothing but the commandline not because they HAVE to (like I do at work) but because they WANT to... and why they may feel that people who use X are lame.

patiofire

01-20-2003, 11:36 PM

I must use X because I do alot of image editing and web design. I would wrather use gimp than editing a .jpeg in binary -- I tried it once, just to see, nothing like I thought it would be.

I use text login mode, though, because there are many times that I just don't want my nice command line to use emacs or lynx or mail or to feel more like a geek.

VWM's are great for many things, but no one should ever be without CL.

win_dir

01-26-2003, 07:20 PM

X is a waste of resources. X is useless for lower level stuff. X is unnecessary. BUT X is useful for image editing, browsing and SOME configuration. Everybody knows how nice it is to have a config tool that does half the work for you, but how many config tools have you seen for the terminal lately compared to those for X?

Beelzebub

02-05-2003, 06:46 AM

Just how many resources are you wasting when you pop open Fluxbox? I can't imagine what kind of machines you people are running. That arguement may have been applicable with a x386, but this is the year 2003. Sounds to me that Linux is synonymous with "i am a cheap bastard who will never upgrade my computer hardware".

How many Command Line Commandos are using 100% of their CPU 100% of the time? I crunch SETI 24/7 and my times are exactly the same whether I am in Fluxbox or pure console. When I hear the gripe that GUI users are wasting valuable resources, it makes me think of my dad (if it took him a nickle to ****, he would throw up).

With all that said, my desktop is always in GUI mode, and my servers don't even have one installed. There are cases where you don't need a GUI at all, but without a GUI I would have never learned how to use a computer in the first place (

DigiExt

02-05-2003, 11:24 AM

I use GUI on my machine but I tend to do a lot of configuration on the machine in a xterm window. If I am setting up a server I tend to only use the command line because I don't need the GUI environment. I think it really comes down to how comfortable you are and what you really need for the situation.:)

carrja99

02-05-2003, 09:28 PM

Originally posted by patiofire
I must use X because I do alot of image editing and web design. I would wrather use gimp than editing a .jpeg in binary -- I tried it once, just to see, nothing like I thought it would be.

I use text login mode, though, because there are many times that I just don't want my nice command line to use emacs or lynx or mail or to feel more like a geek.

VWM's are great for many things, but no one should ever be without CL.

BAH!! Only pussies use X so they can run Gimp to edit jpegs. Real men create masterpieces to compete with the Mona Lisa by hand coding it in binary!!! :mad:

misty

02-06-2003, 04:03 AM

Uh, a large part of my work is reading publications, mainly in pdf format. How exactly would I go about that without X?

mrussel1

02-07-2003, 05:24 PM

I think maybe another question to ask is, "What would the ideal interface be?"

Almost everyone admits that the console and the GUI both have their strong points... so how could you fuse the best parts of both? I guess what I have in mind is something like MS Visual Studio (don't get mad, I'm sure there is something similar for Linux, but I'm a completely new user from the Windows world) that would put the same powerful console commands at your fingertips, but could display info as you type (such as which switches are available for commands, etc.). It should all be keyboard-controllable so you don't waste time taking your hands off the keyboard to mess with the mouse, but provide visual cues so you don't need to memorize switches and such, and will waste less time on syntax errors. Of course, you would still want to use a normal GUI for certain tasks.

That's the exciting thing about Linux... the interface is what we make it. Anybody else have ideas?

windowsfree

02-07-2003, 10:40 PM

I agree with everybody, I have only been using Linux for about a month or so and I hadn't even heard of it before a couple of months ago so I'm no expert. I must say though I will never go back to using Window$ although I still need to use some software that is windows compatible untill I find an alternative program to replace it with, as I learn more about Linux I have found that I like to use the GUI for my everyday applications and I use the konsole to install software so I'd say both are very usefull tools and they complement each other, funny enough a buddy of mine had a large magnet at work today and almost set it on top of another guys comuter, he said "don't do that, you'll **** up my harddrive!" I said "Isn't that what Windows software is for?"

Linux just plain rocks!!!!;) ;) ;)

windowsfree

02-07-2003, 10:47 PM

Originally posted by carrja99
Heh... I had no idea this thread was still going! However, my purpose of starting this thread had nothing to do with support issues, in fact I started this thread in response to some guy on irc saying that people who use X are retarded sensless idiots who shouldn't even being running linux in the first place if they run that waste of resources X.

I was curious as to how many people really think that a GUI is bullcrap and sit at home everynight using nothing but the commandline not because they HAVE to (like I do at work) but because they WANT to... and why they may feel that people who use X are lame.

In my opinion there is no wrong way to use Linux as long as it works for you.

plattypus1

02-09-2003, 02:50 PM

I use Linux on my normal, everyday desktop machine, and GNOME. While I do find the console useful for config or installing software, I would rather run a GUI when doing my day-to-day tasks because it's just a pain to run every app from a CL. Plus, xterm is always avaliable when I need to do some quick command-line config.

bandwidth_pig

02-10-2003, 10:32 PM

I'm fond of both. I refuse to boot into a GUI though (except on Solaris of course). Some of us have been using computers PRIOR to a GUI being available (like myself) and frankly, just enjoy a CLI. Then again, I'm a VI man myself, so perhaps I won't fall into the mainstream. I like the power of the CLI. I just like it. Most likely for sentimental reasons :D

bandwidth_pig

02-10-2003, 10:36 PM