blackbelt_jones
06-04-2007, 05:21 PM
This is quoted from another forum.
(Except that some us seem to equate "ordinary user" with "moron".)
I guess I somewhat fall in this category haha... Problem I see regularly (in RL, not so much on forums), are there are three types of users that ask me questions regardless of platform.
1) Moron - This just so happens to be the vast majority, but seriously... it's the type of questions that I end up responding "You have it plugged in, right?".
2) Moron #2 - Not quite as plentiful as the above, but still numerous occurrences. Basically this is the guy that knows one or two acronyms and then thinks he is an engineer but really has no relevant knowledge portrayed in his question. "I couldn't get my DVD burner to work. You think it’s because I changed my Front Side Bus (FSB) speed?"
3) Enlightened User - I can count these on my hands, but always a pleasure to help. They generally try to solve the problem on their own first using google or whichever is their preferred way to gather information. Upon being unable to solve the problem, ask me detailed questions giving what they have tried already. If only the world could fall into this category... "I can't get my sound card to work. I installed the proper module and xmms to test the card. Xmms complains about unable to open /dev/dsp." Answer: Put user in group Audio to have permissions for /dev/dsp and /dev/mixer.
I'd say the percentages I see of the above in real life are 60%, 30%, 10%. Your mileage may vary.
As one who came to Linux with a barely workable knowledge of the Windows Desktop, I know what it feels like to be the idiot, and I'm fairly certain that the cultural gap between the geek and the idiot costs Linux a lot more than any of real or perceived gaps in the technology. Nobody wants to learn something when learning it makes you feel like an idiot. I've had the experience of someone treating me like a moron who wasn't willing to do his homework after I had literally spent my entire day off trying to solve a problem. I had interpreted an error message to mean that I could fix my sound card problem with Woody if I installed a new kernel, and I carefully studied and compiled and installed a new kernel... and it didn't help. I had been working on it for nine or ten hours, and when I was openly mocked in the Debian chatroom, for not knowing about modprope, I was mad!
One thing that I remember from the bad old days is that finding things on Google isn't always as easy as it ought to be. I can remember trying to find out how to login at the console so I could install my nvidia driver, and not being able to think of a search other than "console login" which produced nothing I could use. If I had known a little more, I might have thought to do a search for "disable X", which probably would have been a lot more productive.
I'd like to suggest that, sometimes, in the chatrooms and in the forums, it's appropriate that we ask and answer questions in terms of google searches. So if you're clueless, and you can't find what you're looking for with a google search, you could ask a question like: "Would you suggest a google search that I could do to find the answer to my problem with my soundcard?"
And to the geek who ministers to idiots like me, instead of saying something cutting like "It's called 'Google'!", :mad: it's almost as easy and often far more productive to say something like "Why don't you try a google search for 'modprobe'?" :) (If the Idiot still wants you to explain things to him in detail, without doing the search, well, obviously, f**k him, he's an idiot!) :p
As I see it, the advantages to this approach are several:
The Geek can give the idiot access to a great deal of information without much effort. The Geek can also help the idiot to learn how to use Google, which is usually the point of mocking him.
In framing the question in terms of search term, the Idiot is demonstrating a consideration for the volunteer who is attempting to answer his question, a willingness to do the effort of finding the information, and in fact, is more likely to learn the knack of finding information sooner this way. It's when you can find what you need to know (not necessarily when you know it) that you cease to be an Idiot. At least that's how it was for me.
(Except that some us seem to equate "ordinary user" with "moron".)
I guess I somewhat fall in this category haha... Problem I see regularly (in RL, not so much on forums), are there are three types of users that ask me questions regardless of platform.
1) Moron - This just so happens to be the vast majority, but seriously... it's the type of questions that I end up responding "You have it plugged in, right?".
2) Moron #2 - Not quite as plentiful as the above, but still numerous occurrences. Basically this is the guy that knows one or two acronyms and then thinks he is an engineer but really has no relevant knowledge portrayed in his question. "I couldn't get my DVD burner to work. You think it’s because I changed my Front Side Bus (FSB) speed?"
3) Enlightened User - I can count these on my hands, but always a pleasure to help. They generally try to solve the problem on their own first using google or whichever is their preferred way to gather information. Upon being unable to solve the problem, ask me detailed questions giving what they have tried already. If only the world could fall into this category... "I can't get my sound card to work. I installed the proper module and xmms to test the card. Xmms complains about unable to open /dev/dsp." Answer: Put user in group Audio to have permissions for /dev/dsp and /dev/mixer.
I'd say the percentages I see of the above in real life are 60%, 30%, 10%. Your mileage may vary.
As one who came to Linux with a barely workable knowledge of the Windows Desktop, I know what it feels like to be the idiot, and I'm fairly certain that the cultural gap between the geek and the idiot costs Linux a lot more than any of real or perceived gaps in the technology. Nobody wants to learn something when learning it makes you feel like an idiot. I've had the experience of someone treating me like a moron who wasn't willing to do his homework after I had literally spent my entire day off trying to solve a problem. I had interpreted an error message to mean that I could fix my sound card problem with Woody if I installed a new kernel, and I carefully studied and compiled and installed a new kernel... and it didn't help. I had been working on it for nine or ten hours, and when I was openly mocked in the Debian chatroom, for not knowing about modprope, I was mad!
One thing that I remember from the bad old days is that finding things on Google isn't always as easy as it ought to be. I can remember trying to find out how to login at the console so I could install my nvidia driver, and not being able to think of a search other than "console login" which produced nothing I could use. If I had known a little more, I might have thought to do a search for "disable X", which probably would have been a lot more productive.
I'd like to suggest that, sometimes, in the chatrooms and in the forums, it's appropriate that we ask and answer questions in terms of google searches. So if you're clueless, and you can't find what you're looking for with a google search, you could ask a question like: "Would you suggest a google search that I could do to find the answer to my problem with my soundcard?"
And to the geek who ministers to idiots like me, instead of saying something cutting like "It's called 'Google'!", :mad: it's almost as easy and often far more productive to say something like "Why don't you try a google search for 'modprobe'?" :) (If the Idiot still wants you to explain things to him in detail, without doing the search, well, obviously, f**k him, he's an idiot!) :p
As I see it, the advantages to this approach are several:
The Geek can give the idiot access to a great deal of information without much effort. The Geek can also help the idiot to learn how to use Google, which is usually the point of mocking him.
In framing the question in terms of search term, the Idiot is demonstrating a consideration for the volunteer who is attempting to answer his question, a willingness to do the effort of finding the information, and in fact, is more likely to learn the knack of finding information sooner this way. It's when you can find what you need to know (not necessarily when you know it) that you cease to be an Idiot. At least that's how it was for me.