[SOLVED] Can Install, Can't Run Linux

[Far North]

I am a complete and utter 'newbie' to the Linux world and am attempting to install Linux onto my system -- AMD Athlon 2800+, 512 RAM, CD/DVD drive, floppy and two 80 GB HDD. One of the HDD has WinXP, the other is for Linux. I will be using a dual boot system until I can speak Linux comfortably, then file windoz appropriately... :)

From the CDs, I believe that I installed Mandriva 2006 successfully onto the Linux drive. Mandriva, of course, wanted a reboot after installation. I guess that's natural so it can organize itself... The reboot insisted that it would start from the CD drive. I got a message 'BOOT FROM CD' in the (I assume) BIOS screens after the system acknowledged the existence of the HDD drives; a master and a slave. XP is on the master, Linux (should be) on the slave. I believe Mandriva installed LILO as the dual boot program, but I can't tell.

A bit of fumbling around using a SimplyMEPIS Live CD, showed me that I have the following hard drives: hdc (with numbers) and hdd (with numbers) plus a couple of flash drives being something like sda, sdb. The CD wasn't acknowledged but it does run (when it has a disk in it). I have the feeling that the XP drive should be 'hda' not 'hdc' but I have been unable to convince Linux to make a change. I trust that there may be some (hopefully simple) way to do this. Perhaps reformatting the HDD, if one does that in Linux? I've done it many times over the years with windoz...

It seems that Linux is unable to find any other drive from which to boot except the CD. I've changed the hard drive data and power plugs to see if that made a difference. Maybe the master drive should be connected to the end plug not the middle. It didn't make any difference...

BTW, the BIOS is currently set to boot first from the CD then the hard drive.

I would like to experience Linux. Any suggestions as to how I may make Linux identify the drives correctly would be much appreciated. I believe that Mandriva installed a LILO boot program somewhere, however it doesn't seem to matter. Linux will not boot from hdd. I just get XP on Drive C:.

What am I doing incorrectly (other than running windoz)? Is more info needed? I am hopeful that you may assist me and any one else who may experience a similar situation. I look forward to your suggestions.

Thanks,
(It's sunny and hot in the)
Far North

[happybunny]

I have not installed Mandriva myself, but during the install, did it ask you something like "Where do you want to install the boot loaded?", and if so, what was your answer?

What happens now with no CD in the drive, and you boot? do you get a lilo/linux boot prompt of any sort, or do you still get default Windows booting like normal?

Your flash drives show up as sd(x) as linux see's usb as scsi.

You are correct in thinking that your IDE drivers should start with hda, hdb, hdc, etc.

Booted from your SimpleMEPIS CD, open a terminal and type :

# fdisk -l

And see what it outputs.

[leonpmu]

OK this is how linux shows partitions there is no C: or D: it works as follows:
hda = primary master
hdb = primary slave
hdc = sec master
hdd = sec slave
partition numbers = 1-4 = primary partitions on that drive
5-9 = secondary paritions 9 what windows called extended partitions

If you have a har ddisk that has one primary parition and one secondary partition in an extended partition like Windows normally does it would look like this
hda1 (c:)
hda5 (d:)

Did mandiriva repartition your hard disk for you? It normally does. Also when it asks where to put the boot loader tell it to put it on the MBR of your first hdd, which appears to be hdc in your case...

[crow2icedearth]

hda = primary master
hdb = primary slave
hdc = sec master
hdd = sec slave

this is for IDE drives. SATA and SCSCI drivces are sda .

I would like to experience Linux. Any suggestions as to how I may make Linux identify the drives correctly would be much appreciated. I believe that Mandriva installed a LILO boot program somewhere, however it doesn't seem to matter. Linux will not boot from hdd. I just get XP on Drive C:.

i havnt used mandriva , i used it back when it was mandrake. I think they use grub as the boot loader. I never did get into mandrake much..

It seems that Linux is unable to find any other drive from which to boot except the CD. I've changed the hard drive data and power plugs to see if that made a difference. Maybe the master drive should be connected to the end plug not the middle. It didn't make any difference...

when installing mandriva try changing to another console by pressing ctrl + alt + f2 and typing the command

dmesg | grep ^hd*

see what it outputs for the IDE drives.

then to get back in setup press ctrl + alt + f7



welcome to the gnu/linux world.

[je_fro]

I'd reinstall and make sure you select to install the bootloader (preferably GRUB) on the Master Boot Record (MBR).

[sparkles43]

then the grub conf file is in /etc/grub. Remember, the first kernel entry is 0 so if you have 4 entries...and want the 2nd kernel for example. Set it to 1. First is 0, second is 1 etc...

[je_fro]

That's funny, mine is /boot/grub/grub.conf
:D

[happybunny]

mine is /boot/grub/menu.lst

[Far North]

Thank you for the replies to date, however, I guess that I didn't phrase my question correctly...

Is there some simple way for me to "convince" Linux (flavour doesn't matter in this case) to give my two separate hard drives their correct designations as required by Linux?

The actual OS stated in my original post is not of concern. In fact, I don't even know if it is on the hard drive -- and don't care at this time.

To recap, based on some tips/questions posed by those who responded to my original post, I have found the following based on Happy Bunny's suggestion to do a "# fdisk -l". Once I found out how to do that, I got the following (editted) information (editted because this is being posted from Windows. Linux does not load on my system...)

# fdisk -l tells me:
Disk/dev/hdc: 80.0 GB and a bunch of other stuff. (Size is correct. This drive has Windows installed.)
/dev/hdc1 *, bunch of numbers, ID 7 HPFS/NTFS as the system
/dev/ hdc2; hdc5; hdc6 with '2' having an ID of 'f' and W95 Ext'd (LBA) as the system. hdc5 and hdc6 are different only in the series of numbers. The ID and the system are the same as hdc1. (I did not write down all of the numbers but they seem to be starts, ends and blocks of something.)

Disk/dev/hdd: 80.0 GB and the other stuff. Size, again. correct. This drive is the one that I planned to use for Linux.
/dev/hdd1 *, start, end, block numbers, ID 83, Linux as the system
/dev/hdd2 has an ID of 5 and the system as 'Extended'
/dev/hdd5 has an ID of 82 with Linux swap / Solaris as the system
/dev/hdd6 has an ID of 83 with Linux as the system.

If you REALLY need the start, end, block numbers, let me know and I'll find them again. To me, they don't mean a thing and I feel shouldn't be of concern.

This comes down to finding out how do I change the hdc and hdd to hda and hdb so both Windows and Linux will boot after GRUB/LILO provides the choice?

Do I need to do something physical to my system? I've played with the hard drive connector and power cables but to no avail. Windows does not acknowledge that there is a second hard drive on the sytem, probably because it doesn't speak "Window$".

What other info would I need to provide to perhaps assist you in helping me?

(It's sunny and very, very, very HOT here in the)
Far North

[je_fro]

Are you sure that the drives you think of as "hda" and "hdb" are plugged into the ide0 port on your motherboard and jumpered correctly? Same for the hdc and hdd drives. Double check the connections and the jumpers.
Are any of your disks SATA?

[Far North]

To Je_Fro:

Are you sure that the drives you think of as "hda" and "hdb" are plugged into the ide0 port on your motherboard and jumpered correctly? Same for the hdc and hdd drives. Double check the connections and the jumpers.

I don't _think_ that they are 'hda' and 'hdb', I only have 'hdc' and 'hdd' according to (what I think is 'Konsole' in) SimplyMEPIS LiveCD... I _understand_, however, that the drives MUST be designated as 'hda' and 'hdb' when running Windows and Linux together. I believe I stated that I will get rid of Windows when I've become comfortable and somewhat proficient with Linux, 'flavour' to be determined. However, my comfort level at this time, is non-existent with Linux and I haven't found a local Linux (if you'll excuse the term) guru to sit down with me and observe. Yes, it's difficult for you probably many kilometers south of me (I AM assuming...), so we have to do it with words -- probably too many right here. Sorry, 'bout that, chief...

I have played around with the cables and returned them to the position that they were set by the 'techs' at the store where I purchased my system two months ago when my motherboard was replaced (the power supply and CPU fried). I have three ports (for lack of a better term) on the motherboard for data cables. One goes to the CD/DVD drive, one to the floppy and the other one (closest to the hard drives) goes to them. I have the end plug of the data cable (40 some pins) plugged into drive C: (Windows) as that's what's on the drive. The second drive has the middle 40 pin connector of the same data cable plugged into it. Reversing this setup didn't make any difference. THe power plugs for the drive are from 4 pin plugs and changing them did nothing (though I wouldn't expect that it mattered. The jumpers are set according to the (for lack of a better term) drive 'manuals' and double checked on the manufacturer's web sites.

Are any of your disks SATA?

No, both are IDE.

Far North

[happybunny]

yes, both IDE, but does your bios see them as on the secondary controller?

I can think of no reason that linux would not identify the first partition on the first IDE drive on the first contoller as hda(1).

I think Je_fro is thinking that it must be on the secondary IDE controller.

[je_fro]

Yes, if Linux is seeing your hard drives as hdc and hdd, try moving them to the other IDE port on your motherboard.

[Far North]

A huge THANK YOU to all who contributed to my question about the drives being mis-numbered (if there's such a word). Je_Fro suggested that I switch the data plugs for the hard drive cables and see if that would stop Linux from finding only drives as 'hdc' and 'hdd'. I did. It worked!

I installed SimplyMEPIS 6 dot something RC3 (as that was the LiveCD that I was working from this morning and now have the basic part of the program installed and running. The GRUB also gives me a choice of Linux or Window$.

Since I haven't really set up anything yet, this message is still coming to y'all from Firefox in Window$. Give me a few days (and a few days of cool weather as it's damn hot here and no sign that it's going to cool down yet -- my home office faces directly west and the afternoon sun is bright...) to figure out how to set everything up and get it running.

The only 'situation' I have now is that Linux doesn't recognize my printer so I'll post in the hardware section to see what the word is re printers. (No reply required here about this.)

Many thank to everyone who responded. Hopefully I'll soon be able to say that I'm not a newbie.

Far North