redhat enterprise linux 4 boots up slow with 2 GB RAM , boots fast with 512MB

[robinsingh]

Machine Configuration:
I have assembled a new machine. Its Intel P4 3.0E Ghz HT enabled processor on ASUS P4P800-MX motherboard. I am using onboard graphics and sound. [Motherboard Spec]
----------------------------------------------------
Socket 478, Intel865GV, Hyperthreading ready, integrated intel graphics, dualchannel DDR400, 10/100Mbps LAN, Serial ATA
----------------------------------------------------
I have put in two 1 GB dual-channel RAM chips (OCZ technologies) in it.

Problem
I installed "Redhat Enterprise Linux 4 WS" on it (installation went super slow..took around 3 hours to complete). Now, it takes RHELv4 a whopping 18 MINUTES to boot up. WindowsXP pro (the other OS on this dual boot machine) boots up in less than 30 secs.

Solutions tried
1)
Since my ASUS motherboard is SMP-enabled and my processor is HT enabled, RHELv4 installed an SML kernel and a normal kernel. But I get the same (very poor) performance from RHELv4, no matter which one (of the two kernels) I use to boot it up.
In SMP-kernel case, I confirmed that cat /proc/cpuinfo shows
2 processors being recognized by RHELv4 (even then the bootup takes 18-20 mins.)

2)
I read online about RHEL issues with 1GB+ memory.
So, just to narrow down the issue, I took out these two 1 GB dual-channel RAM chips and put in a regular Kingston 512MB RAM chip
and RHELv4 started booting up in less than a minute. So now I know the problem is with using 1 GB + RAM.

3)
I confirmed (2) by putting back only one 1GB RAM dual-channel RAM chip, and it started super slow (took around 18-20 mins to bootup again). I also tried passing in mem=1024M kernel parameter, but that did not help either. Even though the cat /proc/meminfo shows 1024MB of RAM being recogized by RHELv4.


I did some search online and found some mixed opinions (which I havent tried yet..since I am not sure about them ,
just listing them here and asking for more suggestions..

a)
Should I recompile my kernel with highmem support -
Isn't highmem only suppposed to be used with 4 GB+ ram machines.?

b)Is this slow bootup being caused by the onboard Integrated Intel graphics ?

Any ideas which one of the above two or (any other alternatives) should i try... ? please help as I am running out of my options now.. Thanks in advance for any helpful tips..

[m3rlin]

i would say you must recompile your kernel in order to handle that amount of memory

[robinsingh]

Hello M3rlin,
thanks for your reply.
What options should i use while recompiling the kernel.?
Any helpful tips/links would be much appreciated .
robin

[happybunny]

not sure, but RH supports 4gb by "default" i believe...at least on the server version.

also, 2gigs does not require the HUGEMEM if my own memory is working.

Does RH boot stick somewhere?

[robinsingh]

Hi Happybunny,
thanks for the reply.
I am using RHELv4 Workstation version.
Do I need HugeMem kernel in this case > Do I need to recompile the kernel for this support ?

Can you please elaborate on the following 2 comments :

also, 2gigs does not require the HUGEMEM if my own memory is working.

Does RH boot stick somewhere?

by the way, both RAM sticks are otherwise working fine if I boot my machine into WindowsXP pro ( on this dual boot machine..) control panel - system shows 2 gb of ram.

Any help would be much appreciated?

[happybunny]

i *think* hugemem is for installs with more the 4gigs of memory ( and up to 64gigs )

When RH is booting.....where does it sit for 18 minutes? is it trying to start a process for 18 minutes? is the screen blank for 18 minutes? etc etc..

also, once RH does boot, when you log in, do you see your 2gigs of ram?

[mrrangerman43]

Just wondering, have you tested the memory to make sure it is good? Just because its new does'nt mean it's good. And also just because winxp will boot to it does'nt mean it's good.

[robinsingh]

Hi HappyBunny,
Thanks for your help so far.. I will soon be posting my boot logs in here .. mentioning the steps that take most of the time (in my 18-20 mins of boot up..) as asked for by you below.

i *think* hugemem is for installs with more the 4gigs of memory ( and up to 64gigs )

When RH is booting.....where does it sit for 18 minutes? is it trying to start a process for 18 minutes? is the screen blank for 18 minutes? etc etc..

also, once RH does boot, when you log in, do you see your 2gigs of ram?

Hi mrrangerman43
Thanks for the tip.

Just wondering, have you tested the memory to make sure it is good? Just because its new does'nt mean it's good. And also just because winxp will boot to it does'nt mean it's good.

That's interesting. How else can i make sure that my two 1 GB ram sticks are good.
1) My BIOS tells I have 2GB RAm when I start my machine and Windows XP tells I have 2 GB RAm when I boot into it..
2) Is there anyother test that I can run to make sure my RAM sticks are good.. in this case. (though I am pretty sure they are good but it doesnt hurt to run a tool to double-check _ can you please suggest any ?)

[dkeav]

memtest86

let it run for about an hour or two

[robinsingh]

Hi Dkeav,
thanks for your response.
I will download the memtest86 (windows install) from http://www.memtest86.com/#install
and run a detailed check on my two 1 GB ram sticks .
Will soon post the results here..

Since I am checking my hardware it doesn't matter whether I use the windows version of memtest86 or linux version.. rite ?
I would prefer windows version since I know that will finish faster ...
any comments..
thanks for your help so far..
robin

[dkeav]

there is no real linux or windows version, download the boot cd or floppy version, boot it to run memtest

or if you have a copy of system-rescue-cd or knoppix they already have memtest, just type memtest at the boot screen

[m3rlin]

hi... i still think you need to recompile the kernel. follow this link
http://www.rackmount.com/pcwsupport/RHlinux/2GB-RAM.htm

[robinsingh]

Hi HappyBunny,
i *think* hugemem is for installs with more the 4gigs of memory ( and up to 64gigs )

When RH is booting.....where does it sit for 18 minutes? is it trying to start a process for 18 minutes? is the screen blank for 18 minutes? etc etc..

also, once RH does boot, when you log in, do you see your 2gigs of ram?

I started up my RHELv4 WS with non-SMP kernel (I get almost same results with SMP-kernel) , here's the breakdown of the time taken during bootup..

Uncompressing linux ...OK -- 5 secs
Redhat Nash version 4.2.16 .. starting .. OK -- 5 secs.
INIT: version 2.85 booting... -- 30 secs
Setting default font (latarcyrhab-sm16) -- 30 secs
Starting udev -- 70 secs
Intializing hardware.... -- 2 min
storage --10 secs
network --10 secs
audio -- 2 mins 30 sec

then the cursor kept blinking...
for the next thing to show up ---- 3 min 40 secs

then the progress bar (on graphical screen and "monitor" picture)
shows up.. setting up local disks -1 min
(** i just got one 80GB seagate 7200 rpm disk)
checking for new hardware -- 30 secs.
Rest all the services/daemons took 5-8 sec each to startup..
(around 15 of them..I just installed the default RHELv4 WS installation..)

Starting HAL daemon -- 70 secs
Then the login screen shows up in another - 15 secs
I logged in as root , enter
the login (into Gnome) procedure takes -- 70 secs
(components like window manager, printing, etc.
took almost equal chunks to startup..)

After starting up, the icons show up on Desktop very slowly
(taking 10 secs) then the panels populate with icons
(one by one... slowly) in another 10 secs.

It took 50 secs to start a Terminal Console..
It took 40 secs to start Mozilla firefox...

However, internet speed ( i have broadband connection) is fine.. I can browse to the sites etc. relatively faster (it took around 2-3 secs to fully load this justlinux.com site..)

Here's the output of
a) cat /proc/cpuinfo (since I booted using non-SMP kernel i see only one processor below.. If I use SMP-kernel , I see 2 processors below.. but the performance is still as bad..)

[root@localhost ~]# cat /proc/cpuinfo
processor : 0
vendor_id : GenuineIntel
cpu family : 15
model : 4
model name : Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 3.00GHz
stepping : 1
cpu MHz : 3001.653
cache size : 1024 KB
fdiv_bug : no
hlt_bug : no
f00f_bug : no
coma_bug : no
fpu : yes
fpu_exception : yes
cpuid level : 5
wp : yes
flags : fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic mtrr pge mca cmov pat pse36 clflush dts acpi mmx fxsr sse sse2 ss ht tm pbe pni monitor ds_cpl cid xtpr
bogomips : 6005.60


b) cat /proc/meminfo (correctly identifies 2 GB of RAM in MemTotal, if I take out 1 GB ram stick, it will correctly show 1GB RAM in MemTotal)
[root@localhost ~]# cat /proc/meminfo
MemTotal: 2067192 kB
MemFree: 1691872 kB
Buffers: 18008 kB
Cached: 170660 kB
SwapCached: 0 kB
Active: 155972 kB
Inactive: 127900 kB
HighTotal: 1170624 kB
HighFree: 897600 kB
LowTotal: 896568 kB
LowFree: 794272 kB
SwapTotal: 4610644 kB
SwapFree: 4610644 kB
Dirty: 680 kB
Writeback: 0 kB
Mapped: 137188 kB
Slab: 20152 kB
Committed_AS: 320500 kB
PageTables: 2388 kB
VmallocTotal: 106488 kB
VmallocUsed: 5800 kB
VmallocChunk: 100340 kB
HugePages_Total: 0
HugePages_Free: 0
Hugepagesize: 4096 kB


Any idea , why things are so slow.. despite my processor and RAM being recognized correctly.. seems like I have to re-compile my kernel.. :-(
I am not a very advanced linux user (* just learning it now a days..) I guess I will have to resort to this option , if there's nothing else that can be suggested in this case..
Any other alternatives that I can try before re-compiling my kernel..????
Any helpful tips will be much appreciated..
robin


(EVERYBODY PLEASE MAKE SURE , YOU CHECK THE NEXT PAGE OF THIS THREAD.. JUST MAKING SURE IT DOES CATCH YOUR ATTENTION, MY LATEST RESPONSES ARE ON PAGE 2 OF THIS THREAD..Any helpful tips will be much appreciated..)

[dkeav]

i take it memtest showed the memory as being fine?

[cybertron]

b) cat /proc/meminfo (correctly identifies 2 GB of RAM in MemTotal, if I take out 1 GB ram stick, it will correctly show 1GB RAM in MemTotal)
[root@localhost ~]# cat /proc/meminfo
MemTotal: 2067192 kB
MemFree: 1691872 kB
Buffers: 18008 kB
Cached: 170660 kB
SwapCached: 0 kB
Active: 155972 kB
Inactive: 127900 kB
HighTotal: 1170624 kB
HighFree: 897600 kB
LowTotal: 896568 kB
LowFree: 794272 kB
SwapTotal: 4610644 kB
SwapFree: 4610644 kB
Dirty: 680 kB
Writeback: 0 kB
Mapped: 137188 kB
Slab: 20152 kB
Committed_AS: 320500 kB
PageTables: 2388 kB
VmallocTotal: 106488 kB
VmallocUsed: 5800 kB
VmallocChunk: 100340 kB
HugePages_Total: 0
HugePages_Free: 0
Hugepagesize: 4096 kB


Any idea , why things are so slow.. despite my processor and RAM being recognized correctly.. seems like I have to re-compile my kernel..
I don't believe that will help. If your system is seeing the full 2 GB then your kernel is already compiled for large mem support, and even if it weren't it wouldn't slow down your system like that. All that would happen is you'd only have 896 MB or something like that available. Does "top" show anything using the CPU when you boot with the full 2 GB?

[ladoga]

I have habit to run memtest86 or memtest86+ overnight after purchasing new RAM. Just to make sure it works perfectly ok.

Linux is generally much more picky about condition of memory (it utilizes it much more effectively than windows) and often refuses even to boot with faulty RAM while windows on same machine can be running seemingly fine. I also noticed segfaults during long compilations being often caused by bad RAM.

But if you tried both sticks separately i guess the RAM should be ok anyway.
Doing overnight memtest might be still a good idea. Even if it doesn't solve your problem you will be sure that you RAM is fine.

Also have you tried to boot with live CD of some other distro to see what happens?
Maybe you could get Knoppix to try that out? It includes memtest86 as a boot option too.

[robinsingh]

Hi everybody,
Thanks for your tips so far..
a)I downloaded the latest 2.6.16.14 kernel from www.kernelnotes.org.
b)configured it for highMem support (1-4 GB category) , Pentium 4(HT), SMP support
c) recompiled it using the information in this article (http://www.linuxheadquarters.com/howto/tuning/kernelsources.shtml)

Its worth mentioning that it took around 6-7 hours to complete the recompile
(95% of this time was taken by "make bzImage" and "make modules")

d) My Grub booted using the latest kernel and..... (first I got a kernel panic ..related to SELinux
I found its solution here..
http://forums.fedoraforum.org/showthread.php?t=1325
(basically mentioned "enforcing=0" in my grub.conf
"kernel /boot/bzImage-2.6.5 ro root=/dev/hda5 enforcing=0" )

Now it boots fine (without any errors..)


BUT .....I still have the same pooor performance No difference whatsoever..
It still takes my machine around 18-20 mins to bootup in RHELv4 WS
I checked the output of cat /proc/cpuinfo and cat /proc/meminfo
and they show 2 processors and 2 GB of ram just like my earlier kernel..
but still the same pooor performance.. I agree with "cybertron" now.. :-(
But I had to try it since many other forum members suggested that this will help..

Now, I am running the memory test using "memtest86" utility as suggested by "dkeav".
Its been running since last 7 hours now .. still not done. (its 80% done with Test#8 rite now..)
I will post the results of this memory test as soon as it finishes..

Any other thing that I need to try in this case.. (I am pretty hopeful that my memory test will complete successfully..)

Any further help will be much appreciated..
robin

[happybunny]

my only other thought is boot off a live cd and see how it performs....unfortunatly, I don't believe there are any RH liveCD's but it might help in diagnostics.

[webwolf]

my only other thought is boot off a live cd and see how it performs....unfortunatly, I don't believe there are any RH liveCD's but it might help in diagnostics.

There are RH based livecd's basilisk is RH based although it's based on Fedora and not RHEL, also I won't make any garentees that it supports 2GB + RAM although the newer kernels should be able to handle that even without hugemem, which is for 4GB+ anyway. Gohead and checkout basilisk (http://www.linux4all.de/livecd/basilisk/1.40/)

webwolf

[enshum]

I think I would get rid of that Motherboard. It seems like you are only utilizing 512 megs of memory maybe less when two 1 gig sticks are installed. Check the memory slots are the mem sticks properly seated etc..

[cybertron]

I think I would get rid of that Motherboard. It seems like you are only utilizing 512 megs of memory maybe less when two 1 gig sticks are installed. Check the memory slots are the mem sticks properly seated etc..
The motherboard may be at fault, but it's not because it's only using 512 meg. There is no way that it would boot that slowly if that's all that is wrong.

I would still check top when you get it up and running and see if a system process hasn't gone out of control on you. I just had that happen on my laptop due to some ACPI incompatibility and it actually caused it to have not finished booting even after I left it running all night. As soon as I removed the problem it went back to normal. Obviously your problem is not that serious, but for it to be performing that badly something almost has to be monopolizing the CPU IMHO.

[enshum]

There are a lot of possibles. I might also try wiping out that install and installing again.

ed

[enshum]

If you have a fast net connection download open suse live cd and see if that boots any better. I have suse 10.0 on a dvd if you would like to try that.

ed

[robinsingh]

Thanks everybody for your helpful tips so far..
Last nite I downloaded the Knoppix LiveCD and booted up another machine [Dell inspiron 2650 Laptop(P4 1.6 GHz with 256 MB Ram )] to check how it works with it. It took almost 1 min (which is okay) to bootup and worked just fine for my laptop. Now, I will try booting up my problematic machine with this liveCD.

As of now, problematic machine is still doing the memory test (memtest86) . Its in Pass#36 and been running for almost 30 hours now.. Does that indicate something about my hardware..
*(my motherboard, ram etc.) - although no errors have been reported so far by memtest86 program. I booted up my machine with memtest86 CD (that I burnt with an .iso image downloaded from www.memtest86.com) and the memtest86 started the memory test on its own without asking for any options etc. -- Is that normal..?
I am wondering whether its stuck in doing some over-exhaustive not-required tests at this time.. (i mean pass#36 , isnt that a bit too much...?) Is 30-35 hours a normal amount of time , a P4 3.0 GHz HT, 2 GB ram machine should take to complete this test. ???

-- As "cybertron" suggested, I will also check and post my "top" output when i boot my machine next time with its RHELv4 WS. I have been noticing my "top" output while recompiling my kernel etc. but dont remember any processing completely hogging down the cpu or memory resources etc. but I will take a closer look this time..

-- I have already tried installing RHELv4 Enterprise Server Update1 (before installing RHELv4 Workstation version- Update3) , it was installing at the same (very slow..) speed, that I assumed its going to run just as slow..
so i killed the installation in between.. and installed RHELv4 Workstation version, which is now performing so slow.. ( if it matters, I always let the RHELv4 install program format the disk and use fresh "ext3" filesystem for installs..)

-- Not sure if a completely distro (like Suse, Debian) would install any faster..
-- Once this memory test completes (..if ever :-( ..) I will try booting up
with Knoppix CD (debian based) , basilisk liveCD (redhat based) , open Suse Live Cd(Suse -based) and see if any of them boots any faster...

would it be a correct conclusion to make that if a particular distro's livCD boots faster, the actual full installation of that distro will boot (and subsequently perform) faster.. ?? ALthough I have personal inclination for Redhat distro but if any other major Distro boots my machine faster( takes under a minute etc.) , I dont mind using that ...


Any helpful thoughts will be highly appreciated..

[dkeav]

memtest is done, kill it your memory/controller are probably fine

next issue would be harddrives/array/controller

run the livecd is all is well, then do an install other than RHEL if problem persists then you have a bottleneck in the hd's

[happybunny]

a debian netinstall should take all of 10 minutes.

If you are willing to start from scratch, rebuild on debian (since it is the fastest install I know of) and check its boot time, etc.

Once RH is booted, do you notice any hardware missing? Like maybe no sound? Maybe there is incompatible hardware in there that it is fighting with??

[robinsingh]

memtest is done, kill it your memory/controller are probably fine

next issue would be harddrives/array/controller

run the livecd is all is well, then do an install other than RHEL if problem persists then you have a bottleneck in the hd's

Thanks dkeav, I killed the memtest86 test, restarted my machine with Knoppix,
it took it 9.5 minutes to fully startup and show the KDE environment.
I would consider that slow :-( what do you think guys ?

Here's the timed sequence of events (of importance)..
I have mentioned times for the time-consuming ones only...
In total , as i said, it took around 9.5 minutes (from startup till KDE logged on and showed all the icons.. etc.))
=============================================
=> 2 processors detected..
=> ACPI BIOS found.. ac ..battery..button.container,fan video.
=> USB found..
=> firewire found..
==== (now the slow stuff...)
=> Autoconfiguring devices ------- runs till end (takes around 15 secs)---- and gets stuck at the very last bar (like at 99%) stays there for 1 min 30 secs....then..
Warning Autodetect seems to be hung..
Check BIOS settings..
Please check ..
Video is (yet) unknown card..using freeX86(vesa) server..
Monitor EMI0309..
Using modes..1024*268, 800*600, 620*480
....
entering run level5..
Staring Xwindow System.. (takes 1 minute..)
Knoppix wallpaper shows up.. but stays empty ..(stays there for another 1 minute..)
Initializing services.. (takes another 1 min. )
Knoppix wallpaper shows up... again ..but stays empty for another 1 minute..
then finally the icons show up...

performance is still relatively slow.. 40 secs to start mozilla firefox..
20 secs to start terminal console.. etc.
=============================================

Moreover, Having booted in Knoppix, I ran the following commands :
===========================
cat /proc/cpuinfo shows 2 processors (like RHELv4WS install)
cat /proc/meminfo shows 2 GB ram (like RHELv4WS install)
"top shows Mozilla firefox,Konsole, top, Xfree86 , init as top 5 processes,
total cpu usage around 20-25% , total mem usage is around 250-350 MB out of 2GB ...
===========================




what should be the next step in this case guys..???

- Memory , we know is fine.. processor is also fine..
- I will soon post the results of "top" from slow-booting RHELv4 WS,
- Will also double-check if my Video and Sound is detected correctly or not..
- For testing if this specific hard-disk is having problems..
a)
Should I try plugging in another hard-disk (its 2nd harddisk -contains my files/songs and is formatted as FAT32) from another machine ..
RHELv4 WS installed on that machine (on first disk) (P4 2.4 GHz(non-HT), non-SMP motherboard, 784MB ram) boots up in less than 2 mins and runs super-fast..

This way we can check if Hard-disk is at fault..
But would this test make sense , since even a live Knoppix CD is starting so slow..?? (here my slow booting machine's main harddisk that's having RHELv4 install on it.. is not involved anywhere - rite ?))

b) talking more about my Audio and video..

b.1) Audio .

If we go back to my RHELv4 WS slow startup's timed event sequence..
"audio" took a lot of time to startup... - around 2.5 mins (out of the 18 mins of total bootup time.. that's a big chunk ...isnt that..)


Uncompressing linux ...OK -- 5 secs
Redhat Nash version 4.2.16 .. starting .. OK -- 5 secs.
INIT: version 2.85 booting... -- 30 secs
Setting default font (latarcyrhab-sm16) -- 30 secs
Starting udev -- 70 secs
Intializing hardware.... -- 2 min
storage --10 secs
network --10 secs
audio -- 2 mins 30 sec

...
...
......
........


b.2) About video..
when I restart my RHELv4 WS, it shows the screen garbled..
(from my past experience I have noticed that garbled screen is normally
shown while starting Xserver when a linux OS couldnt detect the graphics card correctly..
ie in RedHat 7.x days..) however in this specific case, screen does not garble when starting up..
but only garbles when I restart my RHELv4 WS..


does b.1) and b.2) point to some audio/video issues..

Should I try plugging in external Video card.. and/or external sound card..
(dont have them .. will have to borrow them from somebody..) just checking
if that would make sense > ???


Any help would be much appreciated ...

[robinsingh]

Okay guys, I found one more "very interesting" link on google group..
http://groups.google.com/group/lucky.linux.kernel/browse_frm/thread/128c7b9e56018998/bd111f6ddae33715?lnk=st&q=mtrr+redhat+linux+512+mb+fast&rnum=10&hl=en#bd111f6ddae33715

the guy having almost similar configuration (almost same Asus motherboard, 2GB of ram,
fixed his RH performance issue by plugging in an external AGP card.. well my motherboard does not have an external AGP card slot.. (i just noticed :-( )) so I will try
getting an external PCI video card and see if that fixes the issue..
just wanted to get some opinion from you guys..
(since it will take me some time to borrow one such video card... )

[webwolf]

anouther possiblity that comes directly to mind is to check if DMA is activated (if using IDE HD'S). That might be causing a bottleneck in the hardware.

Webwolf

[cybertron]

=> Autoconfiguring devices ------- runs till end (takes around 15 secs)---- and gets stuck at the very last bar (like at 99%) stays there for 1 min 30 secs....then..
Warning Autodetect seems to be hung..
Check BIOS settings..
Please check ..
Video is (yet) unknown card..using freeX86(vesa) server..
Looking at this output from your boot I'd say it's entirely possible that a PCI card would solve your problem.

[thaddaeus]

You may be better off just returning the mobo and getting a new one, diffrent model though maybe diffrent brand. In my expirence asus hasn't been too great for me. I had a mATX board lose a pci slot within the first month and complain about order of cards...that shouldnt happen in this day and age.

As far as what board to replace this with I can't help there, I'm and amd guy, but I'm sure someone can help with that.

Good luck. Also no one mentioned this yet, but are you sure your bios settings are also correct, I've had a system fail to do anything because of bad settings, eventually found the proper setup.

[gwpritch]

One thing that struck me from a previous post is that you have over 4Gig of swap space, unless I'm misreading. I don't think the rule of thumb 2-2.5X physical ram applies when you get up to this level. It may make no difference but why don't you try reducing the swap file and see if that makes any difference.

[dkeav]

it wont

and that rules usually doesnt apply, however some applications, for example very large molecular projects can bring a machine down that has more than 4gb ram because it doesnt have enough swap, so as with any rule of thumb, its purely situational

[crow2icedearth]

maybe you have a process that is trying to run while sytem is booting, that is killing the system resources. Run ps aux to see all process and also run top to see what is using your resources. and finally run the command free to see your physical memory usasage.

Maybe your bios is not set correctly with the kernel and is conflicting.

[je_fro]

I think the problem is a bad BIOS setting....

[ajdearson]

Can't remember what or where it was but there was a case of large memory not being cached properly??
Tony

[rthmjc]

I was searching for issues related to the P4P800-MX and came accross this post. It may be of some value:

http://www.ussg.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0409.1/2366.html

rthmjc