Questions about Linux Distros for College paper

[Slappydappy]

I am writing a paper about open source systems vs proprietary ones (like Microsoft).

In order to have some credibility in my report, I am going to need to use some open source OS while writing the report. The report mainly focuses on the benefits for starting small businesses to adopt open source systems from the start, and never touching anything from Microsoft.

From reading as many articles as I could on Linux, I came to 2 conclusions (which is why I chose this topic for my feasibility report).

1. Linux is MUCH cheaper to purchase and maintain over the years.
2. Linux is MUCH more secure and less prone to hackers and viruses.

I could be wrong in these assumptions, but this is what I have gathered from reading articles on the web and in magazines. I am now looking for an entire Linux distro package to install, that includes some office productivty software and some other bells and whistles. I am looking for one that can be obtained for free, as it will be the version that I will be supporting in my paper.

Also, is there a free Server OS as well?

I appreciate any help.

[GigaShadow]

I am quite new to Linux as well and am using Mandrake 9.1....it was very easy to install and takes care of virtually all of the tasks that I used to need Windows for. There are many other distributions and many can be downloaded free of charge from http://linuxiso.org/. Folks in this forum should be able to provide you many informed recommendations on the variances between distributions. There are also some threads on this forum that deal specifically with your question....try searching for "best distribution".

Good Luck! G:D

[evulish]

I'm not saying you're wrong in your assumptions, but there are always two ways to look at something.

Assumption #1.

Yes, purchasing the OS may be cheaper. The systems Linux can run on may also be cheaper. What may NOT be cheaper are techies that can use, run, and admin it. If you're going to be using it in a company where all people will be using Linux (ie: stapler drones), you'll have to train them. It may be a slight loss in productivity once they get used to the new OS. If you're talking strictly back-end and using MS for frontend, you could run into more hassles with getting them to play nice.

I don't know what the cost difference is between Linux admins and NT admins, but I'm willing to assume Linux admins are harder to come by. They also probably have to work harder so they'll probably want more pay. Although the NT admins probably had to pay for their MSCE's :)

Assumption #2.

There was a page that showed the most common exploitable programs and how often they were exploited. I forget it now, I also forget the data on that page. Not much help there, ehh? :) Security. Something is only as secure as the user makes it. There are loads of exploitable things in Linux (new and old versions of most software). Linux may have a tad bit better handle on security due to how it handles it's users, but look at the latest 3 (or 4?) OpenSSH exploits of late. Any sysadmin that keeps his system up-to-date will have a pretty secure system. Many Windows vulnerabilites are greatly exposed because Windows is just able to be installed and left alone. Also, end-users seem to not think that running Windows Update might do something useful. Usually with Linux, you have to do some work to get everything working. Proper firewalling and maintenence will secure just about any system.

Also, for a desktop system for Joe User is Redhat or Mandrake if you want to go the free route. I'd highly recommend SuSE for a desktop system even though you have to spend some money. As for office suites, the only biggie I can think of is OpenOffice.org (which is the OpenSource equal of Sun's StarOffice...the only difference is I think they removed the database software)

If you're looking for a specific distrobution for a server, then _any_ distrobution will work. Any distro will easily be able to become a server. If you're looking for something a bit more streamlined then Redhat or Mandrake (since they're the rolly-polly "we have it all" types), you may want to look into Debian, Slackware, and Gentoo. Those are the pretty "hardcore" Linux distro's. They don't come with pretty GUI installers, but they can be customized to suit about anythings needs. (IE. my p1-133 16mb ram, 450mb hard drive is running Debian with kernel 2.6.0-test4 with apache, mysql, php, perl, sshd, identd, proftpd, and some other things. PLUG: http://www.mehh.net:8080 :))

Those are just my thoughts. Don't quote me :)

[I haven't posted in a few months...I guess I'm allowed to be long-winded]

[jme]

I would suggest that the best Distro for you to use would be Debian as you can make it what you want (see my sig). You can install whatever software that you would ever need in any situation either desktop or enterprise!

As for as a server OS is concerned, I don't know of any dedicated Linux that is aimed at servers [but Im sure that Ill be proved worng ;)] you can have any computer running a server it just depends on what software you install. With distros like Red Hat you can choose during the installation between desktop/server/development...etc... which will install the same OS but with different aps that will be suitable for that environment. With other OS's like Debian and gentoo (http://gentoo.org) you decide what to install so as long as you install the packages that will be required for a server to perform you could have that os running as a server - I do!

Hope this helps - if not just lets us know and we will try :confused: our best!!

Jme

[evulish]

Originally posted by jme
With other OS's like Debian and gentoo (http://gentoo.org) you decide what to install so as long as you install the packages that will be required for a server to perform you could have that os running as a server - I do!


FYI, Debian, Gentoo, and Slackware are all distrobutions using the Linux OS. (As in, they aren't really seperate OS's :))

I don't know if I could recommend Debian for a front-end for regular MS users. Debian is excellent but not totally meant for people with no real intent on learning something different. For a server, on the other hand, Debian takes pride in security.

[Slappydappy]

Thanks for the helpful replies. I have a friend who is going to get me a copy of Red Hat and I'm gonna try it out. This open source stuff is so new to me, but its really getting interesting. I am glad I chose this topic even though I know it's gong to be hard.

Anyone know any good Linux websites that have alot of articles on the advantages of Linux in the workplace (advantages relating to price, productivty, maintainence, etc..)? I found some sites but none that were that helpful in those regards.

[Satanic Atheist]

Gotta hand it to you, evulish, you covered that damn well. Nice job.

There was an article recently on The Register (http://www.theregister.co.uk) about Linux being more expensive that Windows for the Total Operation Cost. Microsoft commissioned two outside parties to create a comparison between installing a Linux based network and a Windows based network.

I don't think anyone is surprised byt the fact that Microsoft's products came out on top in all categories except the Apache webserver which was only by a narrow margin. The claim is that with the new release of IIS then the they should be top.

The article is on their website, and is linked to from The Register (http://www.theregister.co.uk). If I remember though, their arguments are on the same lines as evulish's and that the cost of construction, administration and maintenance are higher. I also believe they referenced reliability, but it may be a fleeting point.

What was not mentioned was the cost of implemenation. Windows Licences are expensive. If you assume £100 per machine with ten workstations and one server (with a licence for £1000), you're talking £2000 before you've even got machines or staff.

Please note that these figures are arbitrary and were just examples. I do not know the cost of Microsoft licences.

On top of that, you have "essential" software for operating a business (Microsoft Office, for example). Again, you require licences for these. With these costs non-existant in the Linux world, it's not difficult to see why a finance department would favour Linux (who aren't necessarily IT experienced). The long-term costs is what is important to finance staff.

Another reason why so many "established" companies are still using Windows is because they have to. Often, licences (especially Novell if it's used) are for years and the cost of renewal is lower than redeployment of (for argument) a newer Win2k system or WinXP and ditching Novell.

I work for a massive company here in Scotland with offices from the borders to the islands and we still use NT4. With literally thousands of machines, the cost of upgrading is too high. As a joke, I did ask the IT staff if they'd install Linux on my machine and you can guess the response.

From talking on this forum, you might get the impression that I hate Microsoft. Well, this isn't strictly true. A well-configured Microsoft computer is just as good as a Linux computer. It's all down to personal preference (the learning curve, the look, the professionalism etc) that makes you want to choose. Naturally, one major player is cost - I prefer to get the software I want when I want it and I'll take this opportunity to thank the open-source coders and developers for making this possible.

Anyway, about Distros.

I started off using RedHat with its easy to configure interface and acts as a great introduction to Linux. It's not as popular on this board because they've somewhat fallen by the wayside. Mandrake seems to be the preferred introductory system now.

More popularly, are Gentoo and Debian which you'll find a lot of people on this board using. I've never used either, but I know that Debian has the best package management system available.

Personally, I use Slackware, but that's going in the next week or so because I'm going to do the Hard-Core route of installing a state-of-the-art system from scratch.

Using the "Linxfromscratch" website (I forget the link) it's possible to install a complete Linux distribution with all the core packages and everything and simply learn as you go. In fact, I think it's probably the best introduction to Linux that anyone could want. It's clear, concise and only needs a net connection with a Knoppix CD to boot. At the end of it, you have a serious machine to be proud of.

I hope I've provided some food-for-thought with you college paper, and good luck with it. Feel free to post back if you'd like some questions answered.

James

[Obrion]

The paper should be pretty easy man. I am in college right now and have done a few papers for my business classes with the topic. Dig up some good info on our buddy Linus Tarvolds and the creation of linux. Talk about how it was the students way of learning how an OS works and such. Then talk about the evolution of GNU Then what really gets some bonus points if you compare the cost difference between setting up a Winblows server vs. a Linux server. The distro really shouldn't matter because they are all linux just different flavors. Then maybee sum up some of microsofts scandals and how the OPEN Source community rocks !!

100/100


lots of info out there man... and ask away here...

don't forget to have a cool nickname on your title page .. This can easily get you +5 points..
ex. Kyle "THE YELLOW DART" Wright

hehe j/k



:D

[Slappydappy]

Thanks man!

Here is some info on my paper. The paper is strictly based around small businesses. Maybe an office with 20 computers, that are used for light to medium office work. Or possibly software development. As far as someone managing the network, a small business may only need 1 person to do all the work.

Basically the purpose of the paper is to state and prove that open source systems are better in the short term and long term for small businesses.

I am required to compare prices, stability, performance and prove that small businesses that are either

a) starting a small company and are looking into purchasing some computers and servers
b) small businesses that already have these things and looking for a better alternative

SHOULD go with open source over Microsoft. Thats basically what I have to present at the end of the semester. Right now, I am in the process of writing a Research Proposal on the subject.

[twilli227]

quote:
a) starting a small company and are looking into purchasing some computers and servers

With a linux distro, you do not need to buy the latest, greatest, fastest computer there is. Most linux distros will work just find on a modest computer especially when set up right.
With each new version of windows, that older computer you have just might not work so well.
So a new business does not have to spend alot of money on the hardware to run a linux distro. Also, for a small business, using a computer with whatever application it is to be run will work just fine as a server.


quote:
b) small businesses that already have these things and looking for a better alternative

Well they already have the hardware, and will probably not have to uprade=savings. No license fees unless they want to pay for support. That would be their choice, not someone elses.

Hope this helps and anybody can correct any errors they feel that I made.
:cool:

[Obrion]

hmm well i am an IS/Business major. I think that your paper you should prove that the backend should be ran off of Linux/BSD based OS's. While the frontend is based off of what every day users use. Which is typically winblows. In a perfect world people wouldn't mind chaning or trying a new OS, but it isn't going to happen. I think that this could be another positive point. Even though the front end desktops are ran with winblows they have now problem networking with other servers that are not a native OS. Thanks to project SAMBA, Definatly give them some credit in your paper. Also maybee talk about the apache web server. Compare it to IIS (which sucks). Hope that gives you some new ideas.. Bring up server uptimes and compare window crashes to linux crashes. As well as the file managment . Everbody know that you have to reinstall windows every few months after you remove programs and things get all messed up

hope this helps more...

think about that cool nickname... lol
:D

[Satanic Atheist]

In a perfect world people wouldn't mind chaning or trying a new OS, but it isn't going to happen.
Perfectly true.

People are often used to using Windows from previous experience, and jobs. After all, those are the credentials that got them that specific job in the first place.

The more time you take to train people to use Linux means time taken away from productive work. The only way Linux will be accepted as a platform in Europe and the USA is when people start using it personally for themselves.

If you take this forum, you realise that whilst we know how to do more than just type letters with Windows, we can also do the same with Linux, but we aren't the sort of person who is likely to be employed for general office work. Well, OK, I lie, that's pretty much what I do anyway (although I use the term "work" loosely - mostly I'm here!). But I'm just an exception. If I could get into the IT industry, I would, but then I won't be an end user of Linux.

Lastly, even though Windows is generally recognised as the "Universal" business model, there are certain UNIXware applications that companies need. Often, VMWare or Hummingbird Exceed is used to recreate the POSIX/X11 structure for running these programs. There is also a fundamental need to for data transfer and isolating your business technologically does not make for good business sense even if it does turn out cheaper in the long run.

James

[Kaligraphic]

Originally posted by Obrion
Dig up some good info on our buddy Linus Tarvolds and the creation of linux.

Maybe even a line or two about his cousin, Linus Torvalds. :)

But as a comparison, maybe a quick comparison between the number of windows vulnerabilities and major attacks during the past eight years and the number of same for, say... BSD? *chuckles evilly*

[jme]

posted by evulish
FYI, Debian, Gentoo, and Slackware are all distrobutions using the Linux OS. (As in, they aren't really seperate OS's )

Sorry, that was my fault, and awful writing! :confused:

I when I said the different os's like debian..... I was meaning the os's that have an install whreby you get a base system and install programs through 'apt-get' or portarge - rather than the RH etc installs where you choose an install type (desktop/development/server)and the installation installs all of the packages for you..not that they were fundermentally different os's! ;)

Sorry if I confused anyone! my bad!

Jme.

[davholla]

http://news.com.com/2008-1082-5065859.html

I hope the above helps