morons on the open source bandwagon

[El_Cu_Guy]

I just read the funniest "article" over at Newforge. This guy wants to create a web site in which you submit...ideas. They will then be "licensed" in a similar fashion to the GPL. So he himself is presenting an idea yet doesn't seem to want to bother implementing it, which is obvious from the title.

Take this idea...please (http://newsforge.com/newsforge/03/08/14/1223235.shtml?tid=19)

1. Ideas are already free

2. You cannot patent an idea only its execution

Just goes to show you how many people would love to "contribute" to the community but no real clue what the hell they're doing or how to get there.

Dux Linux is a good example (don't start just read). Basically you had a bunch of people throwing around ideas marketing a product that no one had started or even knew how to implement. By the way the project has started but is nowhere near achieving any of the goals set forth by the original [marketing] team.

Note: I still believe downloading BeOS Developer Edition 1.x or AtheOS (and source) would be a better "idea" and put you much futher ahead, at least in implementation of design principals and development, than Dux.

[mart_man00]

Dux Linux is a good example (don't start just read). Basically you had a bunch of people throwing around ideas marketing a product that no one had started or even knew how to implement. By the way the project has started but is nowhere near achieving any of the goals set forth by the original [marketing] team.
Yeah really, i never did get a pm from him...

[DerekKraan]

Since when have you heard anything on the Dux project? FYI, it is coming along, and I don't think it's your place to critisize. When have you ever seen a project just up and be the best distro you ever saw?

Admittedly some of the goals were very wild and the marketing 'team'(lol) got a bit carried away. However, now that a more sane set of goals have been put into place, I think things will actually start to get done. So just take it easy when you harp on someone for being on the open source 'bandwagon.'

You sound as though you don't want people to use open source software just because it's getting popular. Stop being such an elitist.

It's a free world. People can attempt to contribute to an open source project and fail for all I care. The point is that they've got the good will to do something like that. I wouldn't go around telling people they're doing a ****ty job. How about offering some constructive critisism next time.

[carrja99]

heh... Dux was basically alot of hype with no idea at all at what they were doing. I loved the original post by oubipaws for "wanted... a new os" that stated he'd like a linux based OS with kernel support for windows and apple binaries compiled into the kernel, as well as a 3D gui included in ther kernel as well.

ideas are great, but until they are implemented, they are just that ... ideas. An idea is nothing without substance.

As for sane goals for the Dux project, does that include releasing useless package lists and telling people you'll have a new iso up soon and then leave them in the dark?

http://dux.sunsite.dk/pn/pn/html/modules.php?op=modload&name=XForum&file=viewthread&tid=213

[El_Cu_Guy]

DerekKraan --

Obviously you missed the point of including Dux as an example. It wasn't a blatant attack on the project. However, go back and re-read the prigianl post. A lot of ideas and no one knew how they were to get from point a to point B and a lot of people "jumping the gun". Geesh

This post was not intended as an attack on Dux. If you believe it to point then you seriously to to re-evaluate your reading comprehension skills. This post was about one thing and one thing only. Now re-read the thread and see if you can do better this time.

Second example:
Awhile back I read a post at osOspinion from a guy that simply made a statement and based a majority of his article about Linux/Windows compatibility. He didn't state what that meant (network, binary, file sharing, etc) or give any ideas how it was to be implemented. The days are long since past that people who simple "think things up" with no plan on how to go about making them work ended decades ago.

[Sepero]

Originally posted by El_Cu_Guy
1. Ideas are already free

2. You cannot patent an idea only its execution

Just goes to show you how many people would love to "contribute" to the community but no real clue what the hell they're doing or how to get there.I think you're right. But I also think I'd rather have idiots that want to contribute than geniuses that do nothing... Given the correct type of leader, *ehm*, I think they could actually do something quite beneficial. Perhaps I'm just being optimistic - I hope not :)

[kshim5]

1. Ideas are already free


Tell that to microsoft and the US patent office.

[sarah31]

Originally posted by El_Cu_Guy
[B]DerekKraan --

Obviously you missed the point of including Dux as an example. It wasn't a blatant attack on the project. However, go back and re-read the prigianl post. A lot of ideas and no one knew how they were to get from point a to point B and a lot of people "jumping the gun". Geesh

This post was not intended as an attack on Dux. If you believe it to point then you seriously to to re-evaluate your reading comprehension skills. This post was about one thing and one thing only. Now re-read the thread and see if you can do better this time.


not very good etiquette El_Cu_Guy. since you basically had little good to say about Dux in your original post it could be taken as criticism. saying the developers had no direction, while it may have been accurate (note: i know zero about dux), is still a criticism.

it is also not proper to publically insult another member on this forum. i am sure plenty of people with excellent reading comprehension skills understood why you used dux as an example. it is also obvious too, that it is a criticism and as such people who like dux are free to defend their distro.

and as far as i know it is not a sin to throw around ideas, even ridiculous ones. as derekkraan pointed out while goals/ideas may have been wild at one point they have set more realistic ones.

as for the article itself. it is an idea and one that seems to have gotten a very positive response from the readers despite such "news" sites being a domain of trolls and neysayers.

i think the idea is interesting. likely would be hard to make work. it is an idea. perhaps the author will even have the time or the finances to put it to work.

while i may be amused by he idea without action at least he expressed his idea. he shows little selfishness considering it is not entirely impossible that such an idea could have made him some money.

[DerekKraan]

The article that he posted on Newsforge was interesting. He was presenting an idea that first of all he didn't have any intention on capitalizing on. He also thought it would be worth something to someone. That article was essentially a trial run of this website that he envisioned. For example, if someone decides to turn this into something profitable, then the site's existance itself points to the fact that the ideas contained within could work. I personally think this site is a great idea. I have no problem with people jumping on the open source bandwagon. Did you say the same to IBM when they devoted some 400(?) engineers to linux a few years ago?

[mart_man00]

As for sane goals for the Dux project, does that include releasing useless package lists and telling people you'll have a new iso up soon and then leave them in the dark?
Works for gentoo.

There GRP discs dont work and they dont care.

People still downloaded, wonder why it doesnt work as posted, go to the boards and get back RTFM or 'its not a priority'. Nice to know a working distro and a distro that does what it says it will isnt a priority.

Maybe Dux can straighten it out.

Where is that guy...

[DerekKraan]

If you want to talk to someone about Dux, I wouldn't suggest talking to oubipaws. He's kinda busy all the time. Mooktakim will talk to you though. His AIM is MooktaKING.

However, what dux has in mind is not the same as what Gentoo has accomplished. It hopes to use the portage system to distribute binary packages. Now, don't ask me why. I tried to be involved, and contributed ideas to the project, but am far too busy myself to contribute on a regular basis. I personally think that there are some great ideas floating around there, but they really need to organize themselves, buckle down, forget about the isos. Forget about people knowing what dux is and just work on the distro until it is in a presentable stage.

Of course, this thread isn't about Dux. It's about the open source bandwagon. I'll just say it again, I'd be glad if everyone jumped on the open source bandwagon all at once and stayed there. :-P

[Sepero]

Originally posted by sarah31
not very good etiquette El_Cu_Guy...

it is also not proper to publically insult another member on this forum...Hahahah. Sarah, you must not know El_cu_guy's style very well.

He's sort of like an elitest.

Normally, I don't like your style either el_cu_guy, but I think they're being a little too hard on you in this thread. Oh well, that's just my opinion anyway.

[El_Cu_Guy]

Originally posted by kshim5
1. Ideas are already free


Tell that to microsoft and the US patent office.

Obviously you didn't read my responses throughout the Newsforge article. Here ya go:

As to the sorts of ideas that are not patentable: the prohibition is not by category of invention but rather by standards of patent law that are category-neutral: you can not patent ideas that are already out there, and, thanks to a requirement in patent law called enablement, you can not patent an idea that you have no clue how to make work.

In other words you cannot patent an idea only its execution.

Mackay Co. v. Radio Corp., 306 U.S. 86, 94 "an idea of itself is not patentable"

[Sepero]

So I can't patent time-travel until I figure out how I'm actually gonna do it? Crap!

[DerekKraan]

They just don't want people to patent things that they can't do, and then sell the patents to those who can. Patents are supposed to help inventors, not hinder them.

[vze4gmkk]

Originally posted by carrja99
heh... Dux was basically alot of hype with no idea at all at what they were doing. I loved the original post by oubipaws for "wanted... a new os" that stated he'd like a linux based OS with kernel support for windows and apple binaries compiled into the kernel, as well as a 3D gui included in ther kernel as well.

ideas are great, but until they are implemented, they are just that ... ideas. An idea is nothing without substance.

As for sane goals for the Dux project, does that include releasing useless package lists and telling people you'll have a new iso up soon and then leave them in the dark?

http://dux.sunsite.dk/pn/pn/html/modules.php?op=modload&name=XForum&file=viewthread&tid=213

according to the last post, there was a flaw in the kernel, that had to do with modules.

[vze4gmkk]

Originally posted by sarah31
not very good etiquette El_Cu_Guy. since you basically had little good to say about Dux in your original post it could be taken as criticism. saying the developers had no direction, while it may have been accurate (note: i know zero about dux), is still a criticism.

it is also not proper to publically insult another member on this forum. i am sure plenty of people with excellent reading comprehension skills understood why you used dux as an example. it is also obvious too, that it is a criticism and as such people who like dux are free to defend their distro.

and as far as i know it is not a sin to throw around ideas, even ridiculous ones. as derekkraan pointed out while goals/ideas may have been wild at one point they have set more realistic ones.

as for the article itself. it is an idea and one that seems to have gotten a very positive response from the readers despite such "news" sites being a domain of trolls and neysayers.

i think the idea is interesting. likely would be hard to make work. it is an idea. perhaps the author will even have the time or the finances to put it to work.

while i may be amused by he idea without action at least he expressed his idea. he shows little selfishness considering it is not entirely impossible that such an idea could have made him some money.
2 -- that's very polite sarah.:)
3 -- El_Cu_Guy -- plz recheck statements after dux is in presentable state. :rolleyes:
dont knock it til you tryed it.:mad:

[Sepero]

Newbie's, please leave the bashing of El_Cu_Guy to the senior board members...;)

[Icarus]

Naw, just do what we do with El_Cu_Guy...read his posts, laugh and move on :D


other then that, distro bashing is not cool...even if it is Dux, and as mentioned..."dont knock it til you tried it"

So, since this is a mean nasty thread now...

<added by mdwatts>

and brought back to the top after 40 days.... :confused: